GOP bigotry rears its ugly head
By Steve Benen Thursday Aug 09, 2007 8:21amA few weeks ago, the Senate invited a Hindu leader to deliver the daily invocation. Apparently, this has sent Idaho's Bill Sali (R) over the edge.
"We have not only a Hindu prayer being offered in the Senate, we have a Muslim member of the House of Representatives now, Keith Ellison from Minnesota. Those are changes -- and they are not what was envisioned by the Founding Fathers," asserts Sali.
Sali says America was built on Christian principles that were derived from scripture. He also says the only way the United States has been allowed to exist in a world that is so hostile to Christian principles is through "the protective hand of God."
"You know, the Lord can cause the rain to fall on the just and the unjust alike," says the Idaho Republican.
According to Congressman Sali, the only way the U.S. can continue to survive is under that protective hand of God. He states when a Hindu prayer is offered, "that's a different god" and that it "creates problems for the longevity of this country."
Remember, as mcjoan noted, the GOP freshman picked this clown to be their class president. Classy.
Most republicans exhibit signs of significant mental illness. Not just the elected ones, all of them.
If "the Lord can cause the rain to fall on the just and the unjust alike," then why bother appeasing Him? God just doesn't give a damn who He kills.
I asked this question yesterday and I'm gonna repeat it now. What the hell is it with Republicans? Is insanity a requirement for being in that party?
I hope "the baby jesus" commenter reads this post and gives us his/her opinion. :)
Sorry Sali, the founding fathers had just this situation in mind...where we would have people of all different religious beliefs and even some people who don't believe in religion working side by side to make America the strongest nation in the world...but it's no surprise that a Republican doesn't understand that. When your whole party stands against progress in America it's no surprise when you see people with such shallow views.
... and yet, people STILL vote for them.
Either the system is broken, or this country is broken.
“You know, the Lord can cause the rain to fall on the just and the unjust alike.” This year, a bike ride to benefit Multiple Sclerosis was rained out (the only place in the state it rained that day) while the Gay Pride Parade had perfect weather the last three years running. What would Congressman Sali conclude from that?
Voters are getting sick of these people, these bigots. I dont see him in the Senate much longer. George Bush made it OK in some peoples minds to be a out of the closet Bigot.
seriously @ 1:
maybe you are just kidding but that's a very inflammatory statement. be careful when making that generalization, especially if you aren't a medical professional.
anyway, i would like to say that it is important that we remind people that this is NOT the united states of Jesus Christ. It's not a Christian nation, but a nation with the freedom to practice all religions. when this guy said "...they are not what was envisioned by the Founding Fathers,”, he obviously didn't read the the Bill of Rights that were approved in 1791.
First Amendment – Freedom of religion, speech, press, and peaceable assembly as well as the right to petition the government.
pissed off patricia @ 3:
The saddest part is that most Republicans are so narrow minded that they don't see what is wrong with what Sali has to say, they feel that it's the Republican party right or wrong and if it's wrong well, that's what's RIGHT about the Republican party!
and yes insantity and ignorance is the number one requirement to join the Republican party and if you are a biggot too, that means you enter the Republican party as a gold member.
What the hell is wrong with those people? They seem to really love the reasoning of "The Founding Fathers would..." without seemingly knowing nothing at all about them.
"Every man ought to be protected in worshipping the Deity according to the dictates of his own conscience." -Washington
"The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses." -Adams
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution." -Madison
"I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between church and State." -Jefferson's interpretation of the 1st Amendment
I laugh at these guys when they the concept of our governmental separation of powers weas based on Isaiah 22...
They are wrong because it gives all the power to God and mentions nothing of separating them.
Instead, the Founders got that concept from Charles II, Baron of Montesquieu. But apparently they don't seem to research scholarly works that aren't based on the Bible.
Morons.
Where is the Pastafarian ? This jackass needs to feel the noodley appendage.. How about No Friggin praying or prayers at all while conducting the peoples business... I am so tired of my fairy tale is better than yours Bullsh*&
Oops... It's Isaiah 33:22...
What part of this do the Christofascists have trouble understanding?
angry young man @ 2:
Exactly. If God is frikkin omnipotent, then why does He need all this help and support? Why doesn't He just go smite the wicked up the ass?
POP. I can't remember how many times I've refered to the GOP as the party of the insane. I believe it"s in their genes. Most of it has to be heritable. Most of the truly insane are not locked in asylums. They are walking the halls of congress and couldn't be more noticable if they were zombies. Zombies are brain eaters. The GOP are safe from them.
Dave M @ 14:
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/is/33.html ;)
Well.. what can we really expect from years and years of allowing the ultra-religious to express their opinions of the cosmos without criticism. This guy probably thinks he's only being a little politically incorrect. I think this is the real problem with republicans. Liberals practice things like: sexual equality, sexual freedom, racial equality, cultural acceptance, religious freedom, and social justice. Most would call that humanity, or being humane. The republicans have instead labeled it "political correctness" and then rallied against PC as a social evil.
Reasons why I'll never go to Idaho ^^
A guy like that can be elected? I don't mind anyone's beliefs, but saying a Hindu prayer and a Muslim in our congress is harmful for the longevity of this country is just nuts. Global warming or our foreign policy, now that's harmful to this country.
I would have at least respected a separation of church/state argument for not wanting prayer at all in Congress.
The invisible man loves us and protects us, and he doth smiteth the savage horde. Thanks be to you o invisible man for thine presence, and for being more powerful than any other invisible man, and delivering a mighty smackdown to those who would dare interfere with the christianity that our forefathers obviously had in mind with those 'religious freedoms' and 'separation of church and state' concepts.
Bigotry is so part of Republican culture that it is implicit even when it isn't explicit. Like that guy saying he offered $20 to blow a black guy b/c... he didn't want to become "a statistic". What's that other than an incredibly racist comment about black people?
Aside from the issue of a government official using the Bible to justify his views, he misused the meaning of the passage he quoted. Rain in an arid country is a blessing, not a problem as it is for modern weather men and women who are always decrying rain as some great disaster for people's weekends.
In Matthew 5:45, Jesus is telling people to love their enemies so that they will be like God, who loves both the just and the unjust and blesses them both.
1st Scotsman, "What's a Hindu?"
2nd Scotsman, "Lays eggs"
I never will understand people like Sali. They always claim they know what God wants or thinks yet every time they state something in that regard God comes off appearing like a incompetent, five year old child. This is a good example of what I am talking about. According to Sali, God apparently is going to throw a temper tantrum if non-Christian folks are allowed in the Senate.
Just incredible: the Founding Fathers, who were as heavily influenced by the Englightenment as any group on the planet outside a Paris Salon, supposedly wouldn't have understood why a Hindu was giving a prayer. The Senator isn't a Christian, he's a pagan, complete with a pagan's belief in tabu and sympathetic magic.
so why bother trying to kiss the lord's ass then?
Dahgrostab'ph-r-i @ 10:
both of you seem to dangerously suggest that bigotry is exclusive to republicans. i can tell you that even on this blog of supposed democrats and liberals that is definitely not true. look at the comments under the Racism/Bigotry threads (not just by trolls but by regular commentors of this blog). as far as insanity goes, i doubt that any of you are qualified to judge ones mental health. how about intelligent contributions instead of inflammatory ones.
Ann @ 23:
It's funny how they claim that the sole source of all their knowledge and wisdom is the Bible... yet they can't even get that right.
An update in the DKos article expands further on the Matthew, ch. 5 quote.
Blue Buddha @ 29:
Didn't one Bible-thumping politician who wanted to plaster the 10 Commandments everywhere couldn't even name more than two of them in an interview a couple of years ago? Maybe the reason why he wants them everywhere is so that he could remember what they are. :lol:
Ann @ 23:
That is a common problem with Evangelicals. Misinterpretation of the Bible to suit their needs. They are not Biblical scholars and do not use the Bible in context. Just twist it any old way to make it say what they want.
Having said that. This guy is just an outright bigot. I'm with the previous posters who said lets not have any praying before doing the people's business. Have a moment of silence and use it in whatever way you wish and then carry on.
It's like listening to grade school kids fight.
We laugh at them and/or call them insane at our peril. Those people are freaking dangerous and would kill us or force conversion on educated and liberal people, and call it god's will.
I had a friend who was an evangelical but actually liberal-- the good kind of Christian. But, when push came to shove, she had to choose her magic book and her fellow Bush lovers over being my friend.
Now I'm confused. It's supposed to rain here today. If it rains on me am I just or unjust?
I don't even understand what his comment means. Maybe I should be proud of that fact.
This guy needs help.
So if there are different gods, let them duke it out amongst themselves.
Isn't that what the Greek gods did?
pissed off patricia @ 33:
POP
I'm pretty sure you are unjust and going to hell ;) I'll save you a seat.
Thanks Fanon. You better save a bunch of seats 'cause I'm bringing all my friends with me. :)
Every religon known to man believes that their way is the only way, and it has always been thus. Problem is, there's no way to know for sure till we all shuffle off this mortal coil. As a previous poster mentioned, the founding fathers envisioned a country where all people are free to worship or not, as they choose. Having come from a nation with a state-sponsored religon, they knew all too well the problems. Just once I wish a national political figure would call these bigots on their BS, instead of pandering to it.
One can only hope that 'This country', at least the 'This Country' that is imagined by Sali, is soon smashed to oblivion by the hand of his warped 'god', and Sali with it, leaving behind the nation that was intended, where it's citizens are free to explore and enjoy and find happiness in their own beliefs, and appreciate that all others have the same rights, the same freedoms.
What a profoundly ignorant view of the world.
Fanon and POP, why would you want to go to hell? You'd just end up having to spend eternity with Bush, Cheney, Rove, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Krystol etc. etc.
I have a feeling there are a lot of Wall Street investors who will be praying to all available gods today.
If there is a god who controls everything, why has he been punishing us for the past six and a half years? We must have done something seriously bad to god's way of thinking.
He knows very well this nation was not founded as Christian nation. You don't work yourself up the political food chain by being stupid.
He's catering to his base. He's getting in the news so his Christian base remembers and will re-elect him.
Here's an extract from the treaty of Tripoli, sent to the floor of the Senate, June 7, 1797, where it was read aloud in its entirety and unanimously approved by the Senate. John Adams, having seen the treaty, signed it and proudly proclaimed it to the Nation. The treaty is very short so this comment about us not being a Christain nation was noticed by all and appoved by all -
"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion... "
http://www.stephenjaygould.org/ctrl/treaty_tripoli.html
How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
If you don't know the answer, then you're f**ked.
Note on Matthew 5 - - Think of the geography and climate of Israel. Anytime the Bible talks about rain, rain is GOOD!
Idaho gets what Idaho votes for. Sali deserves recognition as the most forthright, upfront and outspoken needle-headed bigot and racist in either House. It doesn't mean he's the worst purveyor of Republican neanderthalism, just it's most vocal.
I think Idaho should be prevented from ever voting this turd out of office. If the voters of the Potato State were dumbass enough to put him in office, they should be forced to live with the disturbing results of that collective decision until the Lord takes him home -- and may the Lord give Representative Sali the length of years of Methusaleh so the good people of Idaho will be reminded of the the price of their folly for centuries.
The current GOP seems to be the party of old, deluded people. I should know, my dad is one of them (he's 74). Personality-wise, he has a lot in common with W: damn near autistic, egotistical in the extreme, unable to empathize with others and won't listen to anyone's viewpoint but his own (given to him by Rush Limbaugh), utterly hateful of Dems but having no definable reason for it and he won't ever fault Repubs for anything (even though he thinks being pro-life is stupid. Yet, he's not stupid by any means. That's what I don't get. By all rights, he should know better. Why doesn't he? He seems to be in a state of complete denial -- much like the adminstration itself.
But, things are starting to change. He knows not to talk politics with me yet the other week he made reference to Iraq by calling it "this stupid war" which surprised the hell out of me. So, who knows. Maybe this really is the last gasp of the GOP. Maybe they really are bleeding to death metaphorically. I certainly hope so. If they don't, every American who isn't filthy rich will get fucked (and not in the good way).
I will consider it a victory to have a Democrat -- any Democrat -- win the next election.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
Nuff said. But I do wish these christian-extremist bigoted whackjobs would just stick a gun in their mouths and leave us mere mortals in peace.
Sigh @ 40:
Oh, no. They are going to be "Raptured" aren't they?
I thought men of god, like bush et al, would be able to take the express lane into heaven. I mean he says god already speaks to him personally. I would think that's a good first step.
I'm absolutely shocked that a rep from IDAHO harbors such feelings. *NOT*
Our gubmint needs a giant high colonic to cleanse itself!
Most of the "founding fathers" were not "Christians" - MOST were freemasons and spiritualists (not considered "christians"). This fantasy of the neocon religious right that America is a white rich Christian ghetto is just that - fantasy.
This country was and has been a melting pot of immigrants since its inception. The problem with the white rich Christians in this country is "OOO! They're different!"
Get over it.
If this country was founded as a "Christian nation", how come the words "Christ", "Jesus", or "Christian" are not used in any of country's documents?
There's a major problem in the US, Middle East, and in a lot of places around the world: That the average level of education of people is/are getting lower. Poorly educated people are easier to manipulate and control. The drawbacks are, that famous (mis?)quote, "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely." The more sedated the masses become with ignorance, the greater the power of those in charge, AND the lower the level threshhold of intelligence to rise to positions of power (and therefore a greater chance of abuse).
The bigotry shown here is merely the result of this decay. Someone of limited education (not necessarily intelligence) rising to a position of responsibility, and furthering his own agenda by manipulating those even less educated than himself .(An aside: Masses and mobs drop to the lowest common denominator in these cases!)
Education at the same time would lessen the "China Crisis" that everyone is gripped by. With a higher standard of living, the first job that get exported is the manufacturing, as most people would feel that these jobs "are not worthy". As the population gets more educated, the economy should shift towards more service, design, innovation and research industries. The US currently doesn't have the proper educational basis for this, but at the same time is still using the cheaper labour from less educated countries to maintain a certain lifestyle.
The thing that the US has to worry about isn't that the manufacturing jobs are all going overseas, but that the money exported this way is being pumped into the education systems of those new manufacturing hubs. If the US is not careful, not only will all the manufacturing jobs be gone, but the US will lose the head start for the secondary and tertiary industry sectors too. Tax returns and service calls centres have already moved overseas, with higher-tech manufacturing and R&D hubs springing up in Far East already (see IBM, Intel).
That is the true threat of China: To make the US so comfortable, that it happily gives up its superpower status.
I think there may be a lot of old school republicans who are discovering they have been wrong about some things, and rather than just admit it, they get angry and say and do foolish things. It's not easy for some people to realize they have been wrong and it's even harder to admit it.
Dr. Matt @ 52:
Come on, Dr. Matt. You know perfectly well that in the vernacular of the day "America" translated to "Jesusland". Don't be ignorant.
I think all this is means is that we better not have a Mormon president. Right, Sali?
Fanon @ 55:
You're correct. I just checked my wallet and all my currency reads "In Jesus we Trust".
I should so be doing some other things, but I'm just having too much fun chatting with you guys.
I'm sure every bug I ever squooshed felt safe under my "protective hand."
Dr. Matt @ 57:
The only place I know of reference was one in the Consitution when they refer to Year of our Lord, but that's primarily a formality for reckoning years. We dood it every time we say AD (Anno Domini).
I primarily used the now customary BCE (Before Common Era), and CE (Common Era).
Sali's living in his own private Idaho
Living in his own Private Idaho
Underground like a wild potato!
(apologies to the B-52s)
these are the guys who leave religion with a bad taste in my mouth. one can still be a believer in a deity without ascribing to the hypocritical religions that now pervade our planet. those who espouse as this guy does to be a true christian are nothing more than the moneychangers of the church. i definitely am NOT a religious man, but i am a believer. everytime i go to yosemite, the sequoias, trout lake in colorado, glacier national park, or surf in the ocean, my beliefs are strengthened. and everytime i read something like this or the hypocrisy that permeates organized religion, i need to spend time in the aforementioned.
I'm waiting anxiously awaiting the daily innovations of a Wiccan, Sikh, Native American non-Chirstian, etc. etc. etc. so that we can truly be inclusive.
I'm from Idaho, proud of it as well. Idaho is a beautiful state and has some amazing residents. Lay off the Idaho deserves it crapola. The douchebags who voted for this ass deserve him, and I remind them of it every day. The tide is slowly turning here, we have the potential to be a blue state again, but when you lump all of us together with the inbred hillbillies who still vote (R), you are not helping. He is hated by even the republicants here, but such is the fearmongering that apparently even a bigoted, self serving total ass like Sali will get elected just because he has a (R) next to his name.
Ryoko @ 47:
My brain is still in early morning free-float, but I noticed something interesting about your quote from the Declaration of Independence. The quote is, "...that they are endowed by (THEIR) Creator..." That seems to make the interpretation open for THEIR own definition.
I was a trial run by Dr. Frankenstein.
These are the most frightening comments that I have ever read.
hadenuf @ 32:
I agree with you.
I grew up in a xian fundamentalist family. Their bigotry and hatred was overt and expressed frequently and proudly. My youngest brother is still an active member of a white supremacist organization. I know first hand how dangerous these people would be if they were to attain any power at all.
Their ultimate goal is to start Armageddon. The idea of killing everyone who doesn't fit their very narrow definition of who is a true believer makes them absolutely moist in the loins.
I successfully ran away from that 35 years ago. The rise of the neocon/xian alliance is the nightmare I envisioned so long ago.
I can't believe I'm saying this, BUT someone quickly send that jerk a copy of Hitchens' GOD IS NOT GREAT!
Clytemnestra @ 62:
As a Witch, I'm getting a little tired of the implication that we're the antithesis of anyones's beliefs.
angry young man @ 2:
The righties feel like they have some sort of control over this. Instead of reading that passage & seeing that it means that we are all equal, they see it as meaning that God is ready to smite those in the other camp. They of course do this with the entire book.
No kidding, those comments are indeed frightening. Scares me to know that there are people who take that point of view. I don't care what they believe, I'm just afraid of what they'll do as a result of that belief.
ysbaddaden @ 68:
Funny, I always thought you were a Warlock...
The whole idea of America being founded on Christian principles is a ruse. That argument is used to keep whole groups of people from having the rights guaranteed them by the Constitution. It is the right wingers who claim America is a "Christian nation." If that is true, why doesn't America act like it? Why are all the programs that help the poor being slashed in the budget? Why is the president threatening a veto every time any funding of these programs is being voted on?
65 Dr. Matt Says:
"'The children of darkness will no doubt rant and rage against these true words…'"
___________________________________________________________________
Although I'm Texan, I generally don't tan very well.
Fanon @ 71:
Crafty folk consider warlock to be an insult, that's a betrayer of secrets.
What the world needs is one more religion.
One that specializes in exorcising republican-crazy-christian-fundamentalist-evangelical devils and demons.
TDoff @ 75:
Democrats?
ysbaddaden @ 74:
My apologies. I simply thought it meant "male witch".
I agree with Naraka--it's not helping to blame the people of Idaho (or CT, MS, or ____).
We all have our state assholes to deal with.
I went to Sunday school as a little kid and the principles I learned of Jesus' teachings were all what I call good things. Don't harm other people. Share what you have with those who have less and just basically be kind. Any religion that preaches that sort of thing is fine with me. Seems too many religions ignore the New Testament in favor of the ugliness and killings in the Old Testament.
Okay, that's my sermon on the topic.
There's a very interesting movie online, "Zeitgiest", which spends the first 30 min. or so describing how christianity is derived from astrology.
The next third or so of the movie is about that date we're not allowed to discuss, and the last part is about how money is jerked around to suit TPTB.
Assholes in Florida? Hell, I think Florida invented government assholes.
"The notion that Christian, more that 80 percent of the population, are an oppressed group in America not only has gained currency among the thousand faithful in attnedance here; it is simply assumed to be beyond question" Edward Humes from Monkey Girl writing about an Evangelical conference called "Steeling the Mind"
This is what drive them. They feel that they are being oppressed.
Dr. Matt @ 65:
Dr. Matt, both Daily Kos and TPM are linking to that site. I thought the first couple comments might be parody but then they just kept continuing in the same vein, on and on and on with the hatred, bigotry and fear. I agree with you that they are very disturbing.
I'm going to guess that only 5% of those comments are originating in Idaho. I've got some good progressive friends living there so I know that they haven't cornered the market on whackos by any means. Michelle Bachmann is just as much of a whacko and managed to get elected in MN.
So, this guy, Sali, obviously believes in more than one god. If the Hindu god is different from his god, than there has to be more than one god, eh?
It makes me laugh every time someone implies that our founding fathers based their ideals on Christian principles. Which ones? The not killing? The not lying? The not stealing? The not coveting? The loving your neighbor part? The usury laws? Even the Bill of Rights requires effort to attach any Christian principle.
Are these our leaders or am I stuck in my own adventure in The Twilight Zone?
Fanon @ 77:
No apologies needed, I've gone to Samhain sabbats where we held cackling contests.
Some might say we're redefining terms.
In old Anglo-Saxon Wicca was held to be male, Wicce female. Plural is usually Wicca (not Wiccans.) However, since I don't care that the male gender and plural being the same I prefer to use the Latinized Wiccae. I don't know if I'm unique in that usage.
In the Domesday book of William the Conquerer were reference to villages that had iudices de wiches. However, the usage is unclear. Is that male or female or both who are of some partially supplanted religion? It wasn't until the 11th century that the Xian flexed their might over indigenous religions. Up until that point they awaited the end of the world with hopeful expectations.
However, Pagans also feared what we translate as Witches, which could be those of rival faiths, those of mysticism of no known school, those born with the skill, mixed with legends of various night monsters like the Lilim of Hebraic folklore, or even figures of vengeance and revenge like the Greco-Roman Erinyes and Furies. Comparisons can be made with the Celtic warlike Morrigu: Maev, Nemed and Babv. They latter reappeared in the Mater de Bretaigne as King Arthur's three sisters under different names, and presumably took him to the Isle of Avalloch (Avalon) to be cured of his wounds.
pissed off patricia @ 41:
Yep, the SC selected GW Bush as President.
the repubs hate everything that isn't straight, white and uses Bible cliff's notes
religion= WORST THING EVER TO INFECT HUMANKIND.
If "Under God" is taken out of the pledge in schools, what makes this jackass think saying a prayer of any kind while doing the business of the people, is appropo? There's a time and place for everything!!