Angry Vet Cuts Down Mexican Flag, Steals American Flag From Business - FoxNews Calls Him A <i>Patriot</i>
By Logan Murphy Thursday Oct 04, 2007 1:40pm
This past Monday, veteran Jim Broussard became so enraged when he heard a news report of a business in Reno, Nevada flying a Mexican flag above an American flag, he drove there and cut down the Mexican flag and stole the American flag. When Broussard appeared on FOXNews with Neil Cavuto, who called him an American patriot, claimed it was his patriotism that moved him to break the law and steal an American flag that belonged to the owner who is a U.S. citizen.
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Note the manner in which Broussard wads up the American flag as he yells threats into the camera. Flying another flag above the American flag violates federal flag code - I'm not sure if it's legally punishable or enforced**, but the business owner says he was not aware of the law and was just happy the incident didn't become violent. Broussard may face charges for stealing the flag, you can watch local Reno coverage of the incident below.
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** Post corrected for accuracy
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Frist!
Makes me proud to be a 'Murrikan!
/snark
What's next? Is he going to go to the local IKEA and cut the Swedish flag down too?
I don't condone the way this angry vet did it. However, it is offensive to fly a mexican flag above the flag of the United States of America when your business is located here. Common sense would have told this business owner that.
Patriotic? Sounds more like the behavior of a dranged homeless person.
might have been a little easier to just go in and talk to the guy? As he says, he was not aware of the law. The owner might not have had a problem with re-arranging it to follow that law.
It seems to be a tremendous disrespect that this gentleman can not attempt a one-on-one level of discourse with another human being, instead immediately resorting to imposing his will at all costs.
Should he be charged? Sure, he STOLE property. Its on video, there is no question if this occurred or not. There is no question if stealing is against the law or not.
Hmm, this ZZ top wanna be could maybe ask the owner what the deal with the flag arragement is and tell him that it is illegal so the guy would rectify the situation. My god, these right wing freaks hate Mexico, they hate "socialist" Canada, they want to bomb Iran, Syria, North Korea, China and probably France! These people are ailienated, weirded out and ripe for indoctrination by nationalist/fascistic opportunist that need war to keep making money! Its quite sad really.
I would love to see Bill O interview this guy in studio. Now that would be fun.
Sounds like a good way to get on Fox News.
Reminds me of an art exhibit by Dred Scott years ago... had a flag reverently laid on the floor in front of a comment book. In order to read or write in the book, you had to step on the flag.
Vets groups came in over and over to steal the flag. Each time, a pro-rights group would replace it. It went on like that for a week.
It amazed me that these gentlemen went across the seas to fight for our freedom, only to come home and fight against it....
It is NOT Illegal to fly another flag higher than the US Flag.
REPEAT THAT: IT IS NOT ILLEGAL.
please correct that folks... its bad enough that MSM is spreading around that non-sense...you guys need to be better than that and fact check.
thanx.
You don't fly another country's flag above the flag of the country you are in.
That is basic international etiquette ask any diplomat.
was that a piece of chicken in his beard?
Patriotic? By violating someone's private property and abandoning the judicial process?
CD @ 12:
But is it ILLEGAL?
Funny how they gave Commander Codpiece a free pass when photos showed him standing on the US flag doormat.
Just more hypocrisy from the Fox Opinion Channel.
It's OK to break the law if you are a patriot.
Chris (and all those that take 'offense' at another flag being flown over the U.S. flag-
Why isn't their outrage on St. Patrick's day, or Columbus day, when Irish/Italian flags fly over the Stars and Stripes. Why isn't Faux News going after them? Maybe 'cause its Mexicans? White folk get to fly their flags, but not the brown? The bigger point might be that in the midst of a war, presidential election, health care veto, etc...all Faux news cares about is rabble rousing.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_...
He could have used diplomacy and informed the owner that the American flag has to be flown on top. The owner would have probably complied since I'm sure that many people are unaware of flag laws.
Heck, this is Bush's America. Talk is cheap especially when we can pull out a gun or knife and solve the problem while breaking other laws in the process. The vet was probably just upset he couldn't torture or deport the poor guy.
Logan, you're wrong. Flying the mexican flagover the US flag is NOT ILLEGAL. Its against the flag code, which is a set of regulations covering respectful display and handling of the flag. It governs how flags are displayed at government buldings and events, but it is NOT criminal law.
Those guys could fly the mexican flag, the confederate flag, or the rainbow brite flag over the US flag. Its entirely within their rights and yours.
Where is this so-called patriot at our loss of constitutional powers? Isn't that a bigger crime than someone flying a piece of cloth higher than a nother piece of cloth?
Anyway, what the heck does identity theft have to do with the event? Why did they take up time talking about it? Was it a failed dig at blaming it all on foreigners?
I repeat there is no "FLAG LAW".
there is a "Flag Code" that is a guideline...but there is NO FLAG LAW. period.
thats it. it wasn't illegal.
Oh for pete's sake.
It is NOT illegal to fly the Mexican flag over the U.S. flag. In poor taste, yes. Offensive, probably to most people. A bad idea, certainly. And it's definitely contrary to the rules of flag etiquette that are, in fact, set forth in the U.S. Code.
But it's a voluntary code of ethics and there are no penalties for breaking those rules. And I don't see anything in Nevada's statutes that would prohibit such displays either.
On the other hand, this "patriot" definitely appears to have broken some actual laws.
There is something called the "flag code" . I thought it was simply good manners. It has been ratified by congress I don't see where it has been signed into law by a president (maybe someone knows more than I). I don't believe there are any penalties for violating it.
I seems crazy to have laws impinging on the freedom to do as we please to a symbol of freedom. That's why a "flag burning" amendment is so stupid.
I saw someone defaming the US flag by making it as a cheap bumper sticker. Can I go smash their bumper?
Thank goodness this real 'phony patriot' was taking his meds that day. He only ripped down somebody's flag but he probably had a gun and was thinking of shooting the owner for flying a freakin' flag.
That's why they call them right wing nutjobs.
Talking things over nearly always succeeds and yet it is so rarely thoght of. It's just bomb, bomb, bomb with these 'patriots'.
I'm sure the owner wanted to fly both to appeal to both sides - in having the American flag ripped off his property, he now has been effectively prevented from flying the US flag at all.
Fox is willing to make a hero out of someone who disrespects another person's property thereby violating the law. These people aren't patriotic - they're trash. The business owner was not compelled to fly anybody's flag over his business. He merely wanted to display is bi-nationalism. This maniac is so full of hate and contempt, he takes it upon himself to "correct" a situation that wasn't harming anybody? He didn't even conceive of just talking to the business owner like a human being. If it were that important why didn't the cops notify the business owner. For that matter, why doesn't this old buzzard run around every neighborhood in America and rip down flags of people who let theres hang outside their homes all night or in the rain. What an ignoramus! And Fox...they just make me spit!
ropo @ 15:
It is illegal (My local news ran the story) but fuck off old man. It could be considered free speech. It's a fucking piece of fabric, OKAY? Nothing more, nothing less. Anyone who thinks different has the mentality of a Jr High Schooler, rah rahing for the team. Grow up. You did NOT fight for the flag, you fought ostensibly, to protect the Constitution. And Constitution protection was not the name of the game in Korea, Nam, or Iraq.
Intrinsically, it doesn't mean shit, it doesn't feel shit and it doesn't care whether it's above or below another flag, on a pole by itself, of never removed from the bag. It's FABRIC.
Yea, but then he doesn't get his 15minutes of Faux News fame....and ZZ Top hasn't had a big hit in a while.
But seriously, the guy possibly committed a felony. I don't know fed law but many states have laws making it a felony to steal ANY flag from any biz or individual. I know this cause a group of friends of mine were busted stealing plain green flags at an apartment complex (many moons ago) and only got lesser charges cause they were juv'ies.
Interesting that Faux doesn't ask if he talked to the owner at all...just what the owners reactions to the mans actions were.
Which law breaking vigilantes are we suppose to let off scott free?
I
Patriotism/Nationalism is kinda reminding me of a country in Europe back in the late 1930's...hmmmmm, who was that? And, with Roger Ailes (aka Joseph Goebbels) leading the FOX Noise machine - what other analasys would you expect from them?
Wow. What a loon. And Faux is proud of him. Good, shows where Faux's head is.
Illegal or not, and disrespectful or not (as a non-American, I wouldn't fly my flag above the American flag if I was on American soil), the fact is you don't just go into another person's property and vandalize it and steal his goods. And this is pure vigalantism. No man has the right to take the law into his own hands, especially over something as petty and trivial as flag protocol.
When will get the FAIRNESS doctrine back? I know we will. And boy will I be celebrating the demise of the FAKE NEWS network.
I've never been to a crazy home. But man, those at fox sure are FREAKING lunatics to call this guy a "patriot".
The republicon defy logic. Let them bury themselves with their stupidness.
miss_kitty @ 29:
Agreed! Although, former soldiers who were trained to know how wrong it is and get in Zealot mode don't seem to care. I was taught that, BUT, I was also taught by my superiors to address an infraction such as that by talking first. Apparently Billy Gibbons had been drinking too much FOX Noise Koo-Aid.
Patriotic???? this guy's beard looks like Bin Laden's
Like I've said before. It's OK for rich, white republicans to stick those cheap, tacky plastic flags in their SUV windows where they wind up on the side of the road or in the garbage. AND it's Ok for the dumbass redneck here in Olympia to fly a huge flag from the back of his POS monster truck where it's getting torn to shreds, but HOLY CRAP this sends 'real patroits' into a rage? Uch.
What law? There's a U.S. flag code. But each state makes its own laws. And Nevada law would make the guy taking down the flag the criminal in this case: Any person who ..., or who tears down or willfully and maliciously removes while owned by others, or defames, slanders, or speaks evilly or in a contemptuous manner of or otherwise defaces or defiles any of the flags, or ensign, which are public or private property, shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor. -- http://www.leg.state.nv.us/nrs/NRS-201.html#NRS201Sec290
The flag code is voluntary suggestions from the government.
It's not illegal to fly another flag above the American flag, in the sense that STEALING is illegal.
From
http://www.snopes.com/history/american/texasflag.asp
"The Flag Code does not prescribe any penalties for non-compliance nor does it include any enforcement provisions, rather it functions simply as a guide for voluntary civilian compliance."
#6 You hit the nail on the hot head. 'nuff said.
I was confused by the lawyer on Fox News. He states that flying a Mexican flag over the Stars and Stripes is a question of identity theft, then goes on to state that identity theft is a problem that costs billions of dollars each year. WTF?
And I hate the chuckle that fat toad of a lawyer gives when asked what the store owner's response is.
No matter how far behind in other matters we get, America will apparently always be number 1 in the world when it comes to our supply of idiotic citizens.
Makes me wonder if this guy flies a flag in front of his house but never takes it down at dark and leaves it to get soaked in the rain.
Just when I thought Fox News couldn't sink any lower, Cavuto praises a knife wielding vigilante. If that weren't bad enough, Cavuto seems puzzled that brandishing a large knife and taking another person's property might get a man into trouble with the law. Apparently, Cavuto's legal knowledge is limited to flag related offenses.
WHAT THE HELL JUST HAPPENED TO THE FORMAT?
Go to RedState and see how bad the RiechWingnuts are freaking out that THE SCARY DEMS WANT TO BRING BACK THE "FAIRNESS DOCTRINE" OH MY GOD SAVE US SAVE US PLEASE NOT FAIRNESS.
It's fucking HIGH larry Us.
I'm baffled.
There is a profound difference between a flag code and a flag law. To the best of my knowledge there is no flag law but almost everyone who has served in the military is aware of the flag code.
Was the act of flying the flag illegal? Perhaps not but maybe there is some local statute that says yes but that is unlikely.
Is there a law against appropriating someone else's property, certainly and the flag cutting nut should be so charged.
But I am completely puzzled about the comments about identity theft by the bozo accompanying him for the on camera interview. What the hell does identity theft have to do with the inicdent. It was a total non sequiter.
But I guess he got his fifteen minutes of fame. What a pair losers.
http://www.usflag.org/flagetiquette.html
I didn't find any illegalites attached. I didn't watch the video, I just ate lunch, is one flag smaller or larger then the other?
It may have just been a visual thing.
The Flag Code is at Title IV, Chapter 1, of the United States Code.
Except as the Flag Code applies to agencies and instrumentalities of the U.S. government, there is no means to enforce the code, and no penalty for violating it.
Neal Cavuto and Fox are wrong once again.
Flags (especially so-called sacred flags) are symbols of oppression, hypocrisy and hubris. As such, they are worthy of only being used as toilet paper.
I'm not clear on Reno law, and I don't know if flying a flag is illegal or protected free speech, but I would think it IS it a criminal act to brandish a nine inch K-Bar knife on a public street and challenge someone to fight you to take back private property you just stole. Actions like that will prompt police in some cities to shoot on-sight.
Vet or no vet...Cletus should count himself lucky that he wasn't carried away from there in a hearse.
I'm sure that this brave and honorable fellow was terribly upset when he saw George Bush autographing small flags at an event several years ago--right around the time there was such rabid support for an amendment to outlaw desecrating a flag.
What a friggin' Loop! Fox wants to make this loony John Brown-lookalike into a hero?
Off the deep end and sinking fast.
Leave the crazy old vet alone. He's probably got a PTSD that his government refuses to treat or recognize.
Whoa! Did the comments format just change?!?!?!
Dr. Matt,
That is what I was wondering - I thought I had too many beers at lunch :)
I'm in awe over the new look here. I go off to do a few chores and come back to a place I don't recognize . Oh no, the spell check thingie is gone. I'm gonna miss that a lot cause my spelling sucks.
What just happened? The old format is back!!!! I did have too many beers :)
Weird. Like an out-of-body experience.
I bet he listens to Rush...
What a p*ssy. Why didn't he just ask the guy? Why didn't he try to reason with the guy?
symbols over actual civil rights abuses
style over substance
that's how "far" we've come
Now the old format is on the front page but the comments page is like it used to be. Am I in the twilight zone of the internets? When I wrote my last comment the whole comment page was different too. ????? I'm lost :(
John @ 60:
That would be like using diplomacy! Real men don't use diplomacy, they act, then stay the course.
Scott @ 41:
I know what my response would have been - "There a homeless psychotic person with a huge knife outside vandalizing my business, I'm calling the police."
John @ 60:
[Deleted. If you want to insult posters here with lies, do it off site-Sitemonitor]
Ricky Bones @ 35:
Speaking to the owner first would indeed be the civilized thing to do.
Oh my god- a real-life Walter Sobchak!
"Angry Vet Cuts Down Mexican Flag, Steals American Flag From Business - FoxNews Calls Him A Patriot"
Man. If that's what a Patriot looks like...
I'm dying for them to have this 'Patriot' in the studio for an interview.
This issue will be a hot button issue later on when this guy is convicted of a misdemeanor and FOX heralds him as a "patriot being politicized by the legal system" Problem is, his potential conviction won't make sense to the "rule of law" conservatives...very sad.
pissed off patricia @ 62:
Whoa, than it's not just me....thank God...WHEW! I thought it was some form of early dementia or a bad cheese omelet.
wow, sorry, but some of you Americanos are waaaaay too nutty about patriotism.... twisted or pathological sentiments and behaviour don't equal love or respect of the fellow humans or institutions of said country.
Questioning power would probably be better. I thought that's what patriotism is about?
I don't like vets attitude, but I believe this is patriotic.
But so is burning the flag.
It looks like theft to me.
Arrest. Try. Convict. Fine + short stay in detox facility.
VietVet8666 @ 48:
To add another wrinkle to this discussion, the U.S. military wears a flag patch on their right shoulder with the Union on the right. If one were to follow the Code, it would be on the left. One justification I heard was that it was leading them on into battle. Hoohah!
Reminds me of my military days when during Basic Training we learned there were 3 ways to do something: The right way, the wrong way and the AF way.
I visited Florida recently and driving down I-75 in the northern part of the state saw one of the biggest flags I've ever seen flying. It was a Confederate flag. Funny how the "patriots" don't have a problem flying the flag of a faction that went to war against America.
I can imagine if that flag was a Mexican flag, the Republican Propaganda Channel would be apoplectic about it.
You know...I dispise BushCo and his NeoCon tumbleweeds as much as the next guy on this site; however you wonder why this guy went off the deep-end...maybe it's because the store owner had the audicity to fly a foreign flag above the American flag...law or no law.
IMO, that situation is but a microcosm of the larger issue of immigration and assimulation...who in there right mind would fly a foreign flag above the flag of the country in which you are?....come on. "While in Rome do as the romans do"...
As an independent, when people start touting "personal freedom" yada yada...and get away from common sense...then those are the people that give conservatives fuel for their fodder.
In this situation, I don't think the guy was right (he could have asked that the flag be lowered below that of the US flag)...but, living in the southwest, I understand his frustration.
We are in the US...I don't care if you come from Mexico, Canada, Germany, or Mars...when in the US, respect [i]our[/i] language, respect [i]our[/i] laws, and respect [i]our[/i] colors (flag)...we shouldn't need to accomodate everyone else on [i]our[/i] land....they should accomodate us.
End of story.
Put the bastard in jail. This is not the time in our country's history to be supporting vigilantes who try to work outside of the rule of law. Of course, Faux supports this idiot - they think they are outside of the law.
Just one look at the guy tells me his IQ is lower than the usual temperature on a typical autumn day in Reno!
Why use reason when you can use force instead?
What an amazing coincidence that there happened to be a TV crew on hand to document the event. And Rambo McFreaky, in his patriotic rage, has the foresight to look into the camera a give his name (and a statement).
As originally pointed out, if McFreaky is *so* concerned about the flag, maybe he should have folded it up properly before walking away, as opposed to rolling it up into a ball like he was putting it in a stuff sack.
But I guess he just wants to be on TeeVee.
The owner probably won't press charges, but he should...
Simply pointing out the situation to the store owner respectfully might have rectified the situation...
I don't agree with this veteran's premptive strike. Diplomacy should have been his first option.
Okay, some annotated Flag Code language:
"Ordinarily it should be displayed only between sunrise and sunset. It should be illuminated if displayed at night."
Can anyone sing The Star Spangled Banner: "gave proof through the night that our flag was still there." Apparently it flew all night, that night, with only occasional illumination by "rockets' red glare."
"The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use."
Oh, no, surely no Republican would ever use the flag for any advertising purpose. All those car dealers must be Democrats.
"The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations."
Puts a different light on the current "flap" about Obama not wearing the flag lapel pin as part of his campaign uniform, doesn't it? And also puts "Uncle Sam' in direct violation!
JonJon @ 46:
The "Identity Theft" is Fox-speak for illegal alien crime wave. The business owner is Hispanic and has a Mexican national flag on display at his store. Therefore, anything done to him or his property is ok 'cause he's already commited the crime of not being born white.
As to the Flag Code, I have noted several businesses in my area that have flow the flag during bad weather, that left the flag up at night without having it lit, and have flown the flag at half-mast in honor of some local or state thing when it was not authorized by the President or Congress. Guess how many times I've stormed up to the flagpole, cut down the flag with a bayonet and took it? Yeah, they are doing it wrong, but it isn't worth get steamed up over. I can just politely call up the owner and point out the error of his flag usage.
"Off the meds" immediately comes to mind.
As both broke the law, punish both. Move on...
Grizzly Adams the flag thief.
He must have plum forgot how to fold a flag.
Wadding up a flag? That's almost as offensive as burning one.
dirty d @ 7:
They hate America too.
[deleted - over the top.]
First we have uproar over the fact that Obama wasn't wearing a flag pin, now this. Sounds like repubs don't want the focus to be on anything other than whether or not we're properly displaying our patriotism.
Seems like there were more important things going on before we got sidetracked. Too bad patriotism isn't evidenced by seeking out information about and caring about the issues that effect us as a whole.
Nick911 @ 86:
Flag hag.
Regardless of the motivations, wouldn't Neil Cavuto be guilty of conspiracy to commit a crime?
Flying a flag over the Star spangled banner illegal, however two wrongs don't make a right. He violated and stole private property. That also happens to be illegal.
Nationalism is a disease. A disease that almost destroyed Europe and has reached pandemic levels in the US since 9/11.
The only flags which I fly is that of The Holy See and that of