Wow. Just amazing. No wonder why my 401k is doing so well despite the mortgage crisis.

War may also be good at causing massive inflation. The stock market may be at 14,000, but the dollar has lost over half of its value against most major currencies since the war began. Does that mean that the DOW is really at 7,000?

Try converting your salary into barrels of oil or ounces of gold or gallons of milk. The ultra rich don’t care if gas is 10 bucks a gallon or milk is 5 bucks a gallon and the Gov can claim that inflation is 2% but real people are really hurting.

Molnardian @ 1:

Wow. Just amazing. No wonder why my 401k is doing so well despite the mortgage crisis.

Bill Moyers
October 12, 2007

Heading for 1929?
Veteran market watcher Robert Kuttner and Wall Street insider William H. Donaldson give their read of the current economic landscape and discuss the risks of the deregulation of the financial industry.

http://www.pbs.org/moyers/jour.....watch.html

people need to start doing google video searches of the word iraq.

they are some fantastic documentaries that you’ll never see on american tv

this war is going to come back to haunt america for many, many, years to come

here is one of them:
http://video.google.com/videop.....;plindex=9

My dad is a ex-military and an uber conservative . He admits that war is big business and we should always be in it. His mantra reminds me of Zorg’s monologue about the breaking glass in The Fifth Element. Cool scene but its better as fiction.

sooner or later the falling (plummeting)value of the dollar has to catch up with us .

I agree with E Ryno. We have an artificially inflated stock market…check out gold 300 bucks around 9/11 and now at around 800, something is wrong with this economy and we are being fooled by an artificially inflated stock market. Wake up people.

We are headed for another 1979 or even worse 29.

In August 2002, it seemed certain that we were heading to war in Iraq. I put every cent I had into GE. Unfortunately, the week I purchased it, the price spiked for that week only, so I ended up buying it about 10% over where I wanted.

The third week of March ‘03 was the best week that the three major US indexes shared in twenty years.

a friend of mine(staunch repub since high school)his favorite saying is “theres no economy like a war time economy”……….now his son is in Iraq.He’s not saying much anymore.

the dji numbers are fake. the rise is because there was too much ira money chasing too few stocks. in 2000, i could buy a euro foe $.85 and now it costs $1.45. many people who bought into the ira fraud, will have no retirement funds when the house of cards collapses.

the big problem with the us economy is debt

the government now has too much debt

consumers have too much debt (i always wonder why my local mall is so packed. where are people getting the money? ) less than 5% of americans make over 100k.

people are just not saving.

nm @ 10:

the big problem with the us economy is debt

the government now has too much debt

consumers have too much debt (i always wonder why my local mall is so packed. where are people getting the money? ) less than 5% of americans make over 100k.

people are just not saving.

Think about this: Our entire economy now depends on consumer spending. If we (general term here) stop shopping for things we do not need the economy colapses. If we don’t stop shopping we will be destitute. Gee, great choice.

For years I have been picking and preserving fruit from inner-city trees, but this year the drought ruined my plans… America needs to learn a raindance.

too many americans are living way beyond their means. i see people at work making 80K driving bmw’s and living in expensive boston suburbs like newton. they clearly can’t afford it (unless their parents are helping them out, which nobody wants to admit)

I don’t even know how you save if you are making less than 250k a year.

StirFry @ 5:

My dad is a ex-military and an uber conservative . He admits that war is big business and we should always be in it. His mantra reminds me of Zorg’s monologue about the breaking glass in The Fifth Element. Cool scene but its better as fiction.

I believe both the monologue and the false belief that war is good for the economy can be seen in the Broken Window Parable

The parable describes a shopkeeper whose window is broken by a little boy. Everyone sympathizes with the man whose window was broken, but pretty soon they start to suggest that the broken window makes work for the glazier, who will then buy bread, benefiting the baker, who will then buy shoes, benefiting the cobbler, etc. Finally, the onlookers conclude that the little boy was not guilty of vandalism; instead he was a public benefactor, creating economic benefits for everyone in town.

The fallacy of the onlookers’ argument is that they considered only the positive benefits of purchasing a new window, but they ignored the hidden costs to the shopkeeper.

Hmm, I wonder what happened after the tech crash. I dont know, amazing growth in india and china. Record breaking corporate profits. A M&A boom. Red hot real estate market. Global commodity surges, and not just oil. Gold, copper, titanium, steel, aluminum, and anything that feeds the growth of China and India. Mix all that together and you have a bull market.

If anything this war has increased inflation. And inflation is the kryptonite of stocks.

Saying that the bull market was caused by the war in Iraq is an incredible reach of epic proportions. If anything it hurt the overall market and economy by putting pressure on oil prices which increases inflation.

jordan,

you have hit the nail on the head. these positive economic numbers mean very little if you factor in inflation (skyrocketing college costs, high mortgages, high gas, high food prices (milk is almost $5 a gallon!)

so any gains in salary become moot with inflation.

unions have been busted, industry off-shored, food, shelter, and fuel prices rising and many people making less money then 20 years ago, so people being in debt should not be surprising. the fact that the government is in debt is because of the g.o.p plan to bankrupt it with deficit spending so as to eliminate the last vestiges of the new deal.

kablooie @ 12:

For years I have been picking and preserving fruit from inner-city trees, but this year the drought ruined my plans… America needs to learn a raindance.

try parking your car with the windows down.

nm @ 16:

jordan,

you have hit the nail on the head. these positive economic numbers mean very little if you factor in inflation (skyrocketing college costs, high mortgages, high gas, high food prices (milk is almost $5 a gallon!)

so any gains in salary become moot with inflation.

I wish I had some numbers on salaries, but wage growth has decreased. And probably hasn’t even come close to breaking even with inflation.

If you want to destroy a society, destroy the currency.
‘

StirFry @ 5:

My dad is a ex-military and an uber conservative . He admits that war is big business and we should always be in it.

That seems to clash with what I assume to be a reverence for life on a personal level, having raised children and all. I guess he never thought that victims of a war might be parents or children too. I’m sorry but that’s a despicable way to see the world.

nm @ 16:

jordan,

you have hit the nail on the head. these positive economic numbers mean very little if you factor in inflation (skyrocketing college costs, high mortgages, high gas, high food prices (milk is almost $5 a gallon!)

so any gains in salary become moot with inflation.

I don’t think the point of the graph is that the general economy is helped by war. On the contrary, only the super wealthy have monetarily benefited from this war. The rest of us have suffered. Maybe part of the plan was to distract us with never-ending war while they rob us blind.

How does US repay Qatar?

Qatar, a member of the pro-Western Gulf Co-operation Council, hosts the US army’s Central Command which directed the US-led invasion of Iraq in March 2003.

It “accidentally” fires a missle (which explodes above ground) on their farmland.

A hop, skip and a jump from Iran, people.

tHeGaMeOfLiFe @ 22:

How does US repay Qatar?

Qatar, a member of the pro-Western Gulf Co-operation Council, hosts the US army’s Central Command which directed the US-led invasion of Iraq in March 2003.

It “accidentally” fires a missle (which explodes above ground) on their farmland.

Are we supposed to believe they are suddenly this inept? First they accidently fly nukes across the US and now this. How do you accidently fire off a missile?

A hop, skip and a jump from Iran, people.

I think you guys are kidding yourselves. The chart doesn’t show any correlation with military action. You’ve got 3 nearly linear rises: the first from 1988-1995, a steeper rise from 1995-1999, and the recent rise starting around 2006.

Iraq I doesn’t even register. Iraq II follows a market bust and the market pretty much just returned to normal.

xoites defends Constitution @ 11:

nm @ 10:

the big problem with the us economy is debt

the government now has too much debt

consumers have too much debt (i always wonder why my local mall is so packed. where are people getting the money? ) less than 5% of americans make over 100k.

people are just not saving.

Think about this: Our entire economy now depends on consumer spending. If we (general term here) stop shopping for things we do not need the economy colapses. If we don’t stop shopping we will be destitute. Gee, great choice.

One morning on CNN the news models were talking about how much money you could save by cutting our Starbucks. But if everyone cut out Starbucks, lots of college educated folks would lose their jobs and health care.

Its one of those paradox thingies.

The news models were talking about how important it is to keep buying stock for your retirment this morning. Made me think of Kenny Boy Lay telling the world that this was a great time to buy Enron stock while he was quietly unloading his.

Its good to be out when the dump part of the pump and dump goes down.

nm @ 13:

too many americans are living way beyond their means. i see people at work making 80K driving bmw’s and living in expensive boston suburbs like newton. they clearly can’t afford it (unless their parents are helping them out, which nobody wants to admit)

I don’t even know how you save if you are making less than 250k a year.

Fractional Reserve Banking uses the issuance of debt to create wealth out of thin air.

This is a great short film . . . my parents loved it.

Money as debt
A short film by Paul Grignon

This is a not a ogical correlation. I love C&L but posts like this diminish it’s overall value as a fair and honest truth-teller.

E Ryno……News Models…ROFLMAO

25 E Ryno

One morning on CNN the news models were talking…

The news models were talking about how important it is…

“News Models…”

I like it!

E Ryno @ 2:

War may also be good at causing massive inflation. The stock market may be at 14,000, but the dollar has lost over half of its value against most major currencies since the war began. Does that mean that the DOW is really at 7,000?

Try converting your salary into barrels of oil or ounces of gold or gallons of milk. The ultra rich don’t care if gas is 10 bucks a gallon or milk is 5 bucks a gallon and the Gov can claim that inflation is 2% but real people are really hurting.

yes…At point number 5, the US dollar was 120…today it’s 78… in real dollar terms compared to the end of the “first mania”, the dow jokes would be 9100 converting to todays value of the dollar.

Your point about rich people not caring about the cost of food and energy is spot on because they are filthy rich and can’t relate. And…these are the people on Bubblevision telling joe six pack they ain’t poor cause “they” don’t “feel any economic pain” between trips to the Hamptons.

as for inflation being 2 %…thats a load of sheet…I think one of the other reasons it’s suppressed is that we can’t afford to give seniors their COLA’s on Social Security, so they strip out all things that matter and do hand stands when plasma TV’s go on sale.

“News Models…”

Sounds much more congenial than “talking heads”.
Or “bobble headed noise makers.”

19 Jordan Says:
If you want to destroy a society, destroy the currency.

You’re absolutely right and the collapse of the US dollar and economy is what they hope will get the American people behind a North American Union, single currency system.

xoites defends Constitution @ 29:

25 E Ryno

One morning on CNN the news models were talking…

The news models were talking about how important it is…

“News Models…”

I like it!

I wish I could take credit for the term although I really can’t remember where I picked it up.

I had a crush on Heidi Collins awhile back. Something happened to her, her brain got micro-waved or something . . . real creepy . . . she no longer asks follow up questions which is what got her in trouble with the alien overlords.

;>)

Dr. Know @ 31:

“News Models…”

Sounds much more congenial than “talking heads”.
Or “bobble headed noise makers.”

Deja Vue! You have said this before!

Andy @ 30:

E Ryno @ 2:

War may also be good at causing massive inflation. The stock market may be at 14,000, but the dollar has lost over half of its value against most major currencies since the war began. Does that mean that the DOW is really at 7,000?

Try converting your salary into barrels of oil or ounces of gold or gallons of milk. The ultra rich don’t care if gas is 10 bucks a gallon or milk is 5 bucks a gallon and the Gov can claim that inflation is 2% but real people are really hurting.

yes…At point number 5, the US dollar was 120…today it’s 78… in real dollar terms compared to the end of the “first mania”, the dow jokes would be 9100 converting to todays value of the dollar.

Your point about rich people not caring about the cost of food and energy is spot on because they are filthy rich and can’t relate. And…these are the people on Bubblevision telling joe six pack they ain’t poor cause “they” don’t “feel any economic pain” between trips to the Hamptons.

as for inflation being 2 %…thats a load of sheet…I think one of the other reasons it’s suppressed is that we can’t afford to give seniors their COLA’s on Social Security, so they strip out all things that matter and do hand stands when plasma TV’s go on sale.

COLA’s is right on . . . guess we get Diet-Cola’s . . . ;>)

weird

Regarding points 6,7 and 8:
“Following the attacks on September 11, 2001, the Federal Open Market Committee voted to reduce the federal funds rate from 3.5% to 3.0%. Then, after the accounting scandals of 2002, the Fed dropped the federal funds rate from the current 1.25% to 1.00%. Greenspan acknowledged that this drop in rates would have the effect of leading to a surge in home sales and refinancing.” Wiki.

So now we’ve got to get through the housing decline. Instead of quick big drop, I think we got it spread out. Like a frog in slowly heated pan.

And the graph is misleading since it’s y-axis is an arbitrary value. It needs to be shown adjusted to inflation, dollar relative to oil (or some other core commodity), and/or debt owned.

Dick and Obama are related.
India doesn’t like nukes. Another Republiscum jumps ship. Global warming is causing a nation-wide drought. Dems quickly lose their spine over the Armenian Genocide.

yenehC hcaepmI @ 32:

19 Jordan Says:
If you want to destroy a society, destroy the currency.

You’re absolutely right and the collapse of the US dollar and economy is what they hope will get the American people behind a North American Union, single currency system.

They have to get a new currency so that they can re-start the madness. Eventually all Fiat currencies fail and have to be replaced with a new currency.

Money made out of copper, silver, gold, plantinum is a good hedge when the printing presses start over-heating.

http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/135.html

Tequila @ 38:

Dick and Obama are related.
India doesn’t like nukes. Another Republiscum jumps ship. Global warming is causing a nation-wide drought. Dems quickly lose their spine over the Armenian Genocide.

Thank God Global Warming is a myth!

xoites defends Constitution @ 40:

Tequila @ 38:

Dick and Obama are related.
India doesn’t like nukes. Another Republiscum jumps ship. Global warming is causing a nation-wide drought. Dems quickly lose their spine over the Armenian Genocide.

Thank God Global Warming is a myth!

Now that the ice is melting, we’ll be able to drill for more oil!

1. The stock market goes up during peacetime sharply
2. The stock market goes up during wartime sharply.

What is the point of this graph?

Tequila @ 38:

Dick and Obama are related.

If you believe the bible, we are all related….to Adam and Eve, right? So we are just killing our brothers and sisters in Iraq, if you follow that logic.

that @ 20:

StirFry @ 5:

My dad is a ex-military and an uber conservative . He admits that war is big business and we should always be in it.

That seems to clash with what I assume to be a reverence for life on a personal level, having raised children and all. I guess he never thought that victims of a war might be parents or children too. I’m sorry but that’s a despicable way to see the world.

It’s very strange indeed. You are blind and comfortable when everything you do feeds the military machine (living on base, using base facilities (tax-free BX) etc ). Being raised on bases and being surrounded by F-4’s and MP’s I can …acknowledge his points and understand where he’s coming from. But I hardly agree with him. The only thing I remotely agree with him about is that he’s not voting for Guiliani or Romney. He says he’s voting for Duncan Hunter (if he survives), but I really think he’s a closet Hillary voter.