Iraq Is Falling Apart
By Nicole Belle Thursday Mar 27, 2008 8:34am
And with all of King George's horses and all of King George's men, I don't think we can put it back together again. I am so sick of hearing how the surge is working because a small discreet part of Baghdad is overmanned militarily.
One word: Basra. The Iraqi bloggers of Gorilla Guides are eyewitness to the devastation:
Parts of Basra were relatively quiet in the morning following the withdrawal of some fighters to the outskirts of the city however much of the city is seeing intensifying armed clashes. Eyewitness reports say that groups of Mahdi Army withdrew to the outskirts of the city after GZG forces backed by British tanks and US warplanes tried to eradicate them from areas that are strongholds of the Mahdi Army. Some witnesses confirmed that a group of the Mahdi Army captured two vehicles belonging to the GZG army type there are reliable reports that GZG barracks have been overrun.
One of our members in the city says that withdrawals appear to have been planned long before as part of a defense in depth strategy. Our members and contacts in city say that there is still a lot fighting going on. They also say that reports in the British media that british troops and aircraft are not involved in the fighting is a flat out lie and that British tanks are heavily involved. .
Udpate: [sic] The American war criminal Bush whose death squad in uniform called the U.S. armed forces are still trying to subjugate Irak and who have murdered innumerable Iraki Children women and men calls the carnage a "positive moment" you can read what he has to say for himself to the UK Times newspaper here.Tahseen al-Sheikhli one of the two main spokesmen for the "surge" was unavailable for comment because he has been kidnapped.
I considered editing the post to remove the reference to George Bush, but honestly, can you blame them for their characterization? These people do not think of American forces as liberators, no matter how many times that's repeated on American TV.
There is too much and it is too difficult in this blog format to list all the reports of carnage, chaos and destruction, so click on the "Basra" link for multiple reports that shame all the media spin about the surge's success, including the heart breaking report that the 9 year old brother of one of the bloggers passed away yesterday as a result of burns he received during an airstrike. His brother, Mohammed, author of this heartbreaking poem, already the victim of so much violence, survived being shot at while trying to carry his brother to the hospital.
Joshua Holland and Raed Jarrar write the Five Things You Need To Know To Understand The Latest Violence In Iraq.
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But Nicole, Busholini told us JUST YESTERDAY how everything is coming up roses in Iraq! Militarily, economically and politically! Now you want to spoil that with the TRUTH?
ARGHH!!! ALL of our politicians are deluded, but especially herr duhbya.
He is right.. the US Military is nothing more than a death squad. They're good at killing people, not nation-building.
Iraq is falling apart? Really? Morning Joe and the tools of MSM barely talk about it. I'm beginning to think the media is in cohoots with the Administration. But I guess I'm just paraniod.
Why has this administration not been impeached?
Surely the evidence of gross-incompetence in Iraq and Katrina would have been enough to hold our "leadership" accountable.
The people of the world surely must wonder at the incompetence of the American people in not demanding accountability.
Thanks for making these stories visible.
For an interesting critique of the American military by prophetic comedian Bill Hicks:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Np6_b-72H3E
And according to an article I found via buzzflash, some of the Iraqi police are taking off their uniforms but keeping their guns and joining in the fight against the US and Iraqi army.
It looks to me like the best thing we can do is get the hell out of their country. Of course they resent our presence there, what country wouldn't resent being invaded, bombed all to hell, taken over and then for the most part ruled by another country's form of government? Bush talks about Iraq as though he is their savior. They don't need to be saved, they need to be left alone to decide how they want their country to be.
You consider Basra to be a bigger indicator of the surge's success or failure then the entire Anbar Province? A province that includes Ramadi and Fallujah? A province that actually had people sent to it as part of the surge (Anbar Province and Baghdad...Basra is way in the South and was controlled by the British and wasn't part of the surge strategy).?
I mean, I'm okay with you feeling that Bush lied yet again. I'm okay with saying that things in Iraq are not going too well, and that Basra is a sign that things aren't as under control as our own government claims they are.
But using Basra as any indicator of the surge strategy betrays a bit of ignorance on your part.
accoring to Cheney the surge has WORKED, not working.... but it's WORKED!!!! and the Iraq war has been a success, now perhaps if the objective was to cause as much chaos, huge loss of life , start a civil war, destroy Iraq and cause a humanitarian crisis then i guess it was a success ?.
Why remove the reference to Bush? Based upon what we know now, and what we have seen, Bush IS a War Criminal. God, how I wish we had a parliamentary system so we could have removed Bush and Chenney from office LONG ago.
P.S. I am a Republican.
I did hear on tv last night that some of Blackwater's helicopters were destroyed. I think it was near the green zone, but I'm not positive.
K at comment 6, are you aware that Baghdad is under curfew and the green zone is locked down?
Soon, the word “surge” will be stricken from the public record. Not sure what the three stooges (McCain, Lieberman & Graham) will talk about then. I’m sure they will come up with something outlandish.
What do you want, a medal?
Just kidding, glad to see there are members of his own party who realize that lockstep isn't the way to go...
Leaving would be the best thing for us to do for the civilians and everyone else in Iraq.
Sorry.
pissed off patricia @ 9:
The Iraqi's have named a disease after Blackwater
What does GZG stand for? I tried googling, but only got something about Zero War Games.
The long predicted Iraqi "Tet Offensive" has finally arrived.
why would you edit their post?
And the corporate mafia called the 'msm' will continue to tell us the surge is working, the surge is working ........ iraq is a success ... the corporate pimps/whores/sluts called williams, couric, scarborough, gibson, fox news, and all the rest of them will do all they can to manipulate public perception yet again to benefit their corporate boy McBush in order to sustain a government by and for the few: greed ...... and these corporate pigs called the 'elite media' will collect their million dollar paydays in doing so ... meanwhile our teachers of our children will get their $30,000 a year .......
They can easily pull it off too. Remember when "Stay The Course" went the way of the Dodo in terms of the popular political lexicon? Tony Snowjob, with a straight face no less, standing up their claiming "This a great story, because we went back and looked today and could only find eight times where he ever used the phrase stay the course." It'll be the same shit with the "Surge" when they start bombing Iran, it creates chaos, and they then say well, we need an Escalation. People will say, isn't that the same bullshit as the Surge you tried that failed miserably? Spokesperson of the moment: "That's really funny because actually we can only find one instance where the president (or "interim" dictator once martial law is declared to quell the public outrage over bombing Iran...) ever mentioned anything about surges..."
andy @ 13:
Anything associated with that name scares me. Reading the book about them makes you see red, and now this. Maybe along with getting our troops out of there, the Iraqis would appreciate getting blackwater out of there as well.
Why should we worry about Iraq? King Bush said things are going swimmingly. MSM doesn't deem Iraq news worthy. The talking heads are in a frenzy over Barack and Billary. Meanwhile the Iraq is becoming a hellish nightmare. Jesus, how are we every going to get out of this mess.
pissed off patricia @ 19:
Iraq was doomed the day we violently invaded their nation.
This article gives aid and comfort to the enemy.
oops, my comment went into the blockquote...
Actually from what I've heard Blackwater Fever was already called that...it's just a really twisted coincidence.
23 fry Says: This article gives aid and comfort to the enemy.
No more so than Bush and his policies playing right into the hands of those he purports to fight against...
The American armed forces have been nothing but death squads for dozens of years. In all corners of the world the U.S. armed forces and their surrogates have spread havoc death and despair in large measures. No one is ever happy to see the U. S. army coming. Peaceful, free countries have been laid to waste by the army and their pawns, from South America to Africa to the middle east to the far east. American policies have ruined the lives of millions.
K @ 6:
Ya, I think the ignorance belongs to you. We pile troops into Baghdad and the fighting moves to Basra. Get it? The surge strategy likely is working. It was probably intended to secure an area of Iraq and then make sure that area is the only one that appears on the news. Then people will believe the surge to be a success and claim that anyone with evidence that says otherwise is ignorant.
K @ 6:
If nothing else, this shows why the surge was a stupid idea in the first place. Military commanders have been describing their efforts to kill Iraqis as a game of Whack-a-Mole for years. I don't know who reasonably thought that putting a lot of guns in one part of the country would not lead to increased "insurgent" activity in other parts of the country. And the fact that this is the Mahdi Army fighting us again IS a big indicator that their strategic goals are failing. Apparently paying people to stop shooting at you doesn't work so well if you keep shooting at them. Who knew?
And Nicole, I second Robert's thoughts on Bush. Why even consider removing a factual description of our president from the post? If illegally and aggressively invading a country without provocation does not classify one as a war criminal, what would? He violated laws to start a war. That's the definition of a war criminal. Don't tell me you're turning into one of the "Very Reasonable People" who doesn't want to say anything controversial? :)
To be fair, Iraq was the lead story on ABC news last night. They gave it a lot of coverage.
pissed off patricia @ 9:
And they'll bill those back to the taxpayer at what? $10 billion each?
pissed off patricia @ 19:
Actually, I think that many Iraqis would just love to have Blackwater stay in Iraq. So long as it's staked out in the desert naked at high noon on a termite mound.
Can't chat right now weaseldog, I'm off to shop at Wal-mart.
I'm just teasing you. But I did understand your message.
Seeing these stories and what I saw on tv last night, makes what bush said yesterday the words of a crazy man. No wonder he was talking so loud and acting so angry, it's hard work lying out your ass and trying to convince people that a fire is out when the flames are still roaring.
Let's be careful here. That is the job of the army, to kill people. An army is really nothing more than a state sanctioned death squad, but the death inflicted is only supposed to be against other death squads in order to take your opponent's death squad away (i.e. military victory). However, the individual soldiers do not deserve a name with connotations like "death squad" has. There are many people in the military who did not sign up because they want to kill people. There are many people in the military who signed up because they truly believed they would be fighting the forces of evil and all that (whether or not that makes them deluded is irrelevant). What you are talking about is the policies that the army is forced to enact/the strategies that are thrust upon them, that due to the nature of a civilian controlled armed force, they are duty-bound to follow. No, you do not have any obligation to follow an illegal order on an individual level, so if an officer orders a grunt to commit a war crime, they are legally bound to refuse...but what happens when the pretenses and the basis for you being in this situation was the illegal part? The soldiers are already there, by virtue of this every combat kill is technically a war crime, but not one of their choosing, they have no choice to keep on doing what they are doing because it's not like they can all simultaneously put down their weapons, hope those they are fighting don't shoot at them in the meantime, and wait for their country to come and get them out...
Ugh...this war/occupation is so fucking tragic on so many levels...
Americans deserve the problems they get.
Americans don't deserve the problems they get.
The answer lies somewhere in the middle.
In the case of Iraq specifically, the soldiers don't deserve the crap they've been dealt, but the American homeland foreclosure debacle is deserved.
America's economic dominance is coming to an end, and a rebalancing of economic forces is occurring.
Years from now when the globe emerges from its current recession, America won't be playing just football anymore; it'll be forced to take up soccer and play it on the world stage in order to stay competitive. And since we suck at the sport, we'll have a lot of catching up to do.
With apologies to Chanel, it's time for a new perfume product:
"Share the fantasy, Bush, no. 43."
Just a few spritzes of Bush no. 43, and your scent will get people thinking that "people are going to look back at this moment in history and say a democracy in Iraq helped change the world for the better."
Bush, no 43. The magical perfume that covers up the stink of war.
When the Russians were pretending to rid Afghanistan's people of their rigid rule, the Russians were looked at, after a couple of years, not as liberators but Occupiers. Then after reagan armed the mujahadeen the rest of the Islamic world joined in the fight against the Russian. Fighters started showing up from Egypt, Iran, Pakistan etc. to fight them. Infidels were not wanted in an Islamic country.
Bush was told before going into Iraq that he was going to face the same consequences if he went in and tried so set up any permanence of presence. Powell told him "If we Break it we're stuck in a quagmire". Krinsiki told them they needed hundreds of thousands to accomplish what the wanted, many other generals said the same. But bush knew better. His man Rumsfeld knew better and their "advisor's" told them to dismantle the Iraqi Army, instead of utilizing them to keep an insurgence from happening. Again, non-military men made the call and set up the perfect failure.
Bush believes his own lies now and expects us to have faith in him even though we can see he is making the same mistakes over and over.
See any comparison here. Non-Islamics are still never going to be welcome in an Islamic land. Osama Bin Ladin knew he couldn't beat the American military so he wanted to take the American Economy down, so he attacked out financial heart.
Bush then accommodated him by started a war that can't be won and is doing exactly what Bin Ladin wanted to do. Destroy our economy.
Bin Ladin couldn't have wished for a better ally that bush.
Bush is happy with the w
pissed off patricia @ 32:
And, of course, NO ONE (as of yet) has the cajones to simply tell Busholini "YOU ARE A DELUSIONAL LIAR!"
Bush is happy with the war. He calls it a success.
Iraq is going exactly hte way he wanted it to go.
How can you call this a mistake?
Weaseldog @ 39:
The war is a success to the military industrial complex and the oil companies.
The rest is all F*cked.
No. 44 @ 35:
I like to refer him as Bush, no 2. ....there's no substitute for real defecation.
Dr. Acula @ 38:
Actually I did yesterday sitting at the island in my kitchen while watching him on tv as he gave that speech. But, I don't know if that counts.
Iraq was NEVER really together to fall apart!
pissed off patricia @ 42:
Right, me too -- I should have clarified -- no one in the "media"... not even KO. When the "president" can outright lie (well, he's been doing it for 7-1/2 years) without any consequence, our status as a "democracy" is truly questionable.
pissed off patricia @ 42:
it's good enough for me. :)
Considering Iraq by itself is like watching Ophelia's madness scene in Hamlet, and deducing the play's plot from that, if you can.
The most one can discern is that something is terribly wrong, is unholy rotten.
Iraq is but a theater in a strategic war to dominate the oil sources in the Middle East, thereby throttling America's emerging "enemy economies" -- China, India, Brazil -- and restricting Russia to minding its own affairs instead of growing its presence on the world stage.
The strategic goal is owning and operating the Caspian Basin region, and all points south of there. Puppet states or failed states from Baku to Beirut is the end goal. All lesser goals are adjustable and fungible under that one.
It's Baku or Bust, boys.
Iraq is but a beachhead. So is Iran. So is Syria, and so is Saudi Arabia if it ever goes flaky. That's American oil under that sand, so it's Give Over Or Die from here on out.
The challenge for the American Empire is to make itself "vital" to the "security and democracy" of fabled Syriana, the crescent shaped region stretching from the Caspian to the eastern Med. That's largely a PR challenge, not a military one. After we nuke a couple of bunkers in Persia, those Caspian states will be lining up to become wholly owned subsidiaries of America, Inc.
It's a sales job. There are point three billion Americans walking around right now -- less than three hundred thousand of them will reap virtually ALL the wealth being stolen over there.
Whether the Republic survives never bothered these folks. Whether the American Empire survives doesn't trouble them either. They and their money will be welcome anywhere in the world. They currently own and operate the biggest, baddest military and economic power in human history, and they use it to rape, pillage, and steal.
It's their machine. It's not your father's Republic.
Well over 90% of Americans are just along for the ride from this point.
As long as they are not willing to lop off heads, a la carte, that is.
This war will pay for itself.
The insurgency is in its death throes.
it will all be over in six months, tops.
etc. Our leaders have no idea what they're doing in Iraq. The strategy behind the surge might work if we had a million troops in Iraq, but we just don't have enough guys to hold the ground. Add to that the fact that we're buying a peace - giving money to the people who might spend that money on guns and then turn around and shoot at us.
Did anyone catch in the Frontline special that we gave Motata al Sadr 330 million$? That's a lot of ammo for ak47s.
you wanted to edit out bush, but keep the u.s.death squad in uniform comment?
I've been commenting about the war ever since I've been involved, my viewpoints are left of center, and so now I'm a "Death squad member".
Wow.. way to go on setting the bar for objective reporting..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda
♣Bangkok Bob♠ Says: When the Russians were pretending to rid Afghanistan’s people of their rigid rule, the Russians were looked at, after a couple of years, not as liberators but Occupiers. Then after reagan armed the mujahadeen the rest of the Islamic world joined in the fight against the Russian. Fighters started showing up from Egypt, Iran, Pakistan etc. to fight them. Infidels were not wanted in an Islamic country.
I agree totally except one thing. The mujahideen were fighting the Soviets. The distinction is important because at the time they were one of the world's 2 superpowers. But they did something dumb. The tried to invade and occupy another nation. This cost them, cost them a lot. The Soviet Union literally disappeared from the map. I hope the U.S. never makes the mistake of carrying out a long and costly occupation in an islamic nation. D'oh!
Let's see if I can show my ignorance here for the world to see...at least the world of C&L. Bush said yesterday that Iraqi oil revenues were way up last year. Couldn't that just mean that because the price of oil rose so much last year they would logically make more money, not that they were necessarily able to pump more oil?
i guess this proves that the decrease in violence had nothing to do with the "surge" and everything to do with the bribe and ceasefire, right? of course the media will completely ignore this, because they would have to admit that they were guilty of toeing the line for this administration AGAIN.
I wish I was more like my mother. Just put all my faith in god. Turn off the TV. Wrap myself in denial and move on. But I can't. My children depend on me to be smart. Oh well.
duncanidho @ 47:
I surely don't see the soldiers as "death squads" but they may look that way to some Iraqi families. Just because they are people who invaded their lives and frighten the hell out of them.
#11 on my "Year 2008 Predictions" was that "The Surge has merely clamped down the lid on a boiling pot" without addressing the underlying problems, and if left unchanged, would explode in violence.
But I also predicted it wouldn't happen until July. Foolish me.
pissed off patricia @ 49:
Yup.
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 36:
Bad news, Mr and Mrs Six pack.... But the outlook is not good. Iraq is in a civil war, and there is nothing we can do to stop it. The best thing I can do is pretend to have control of the country, and run out the clock till Election Day. True, nothing will change, but then, it will be some other President's headache.
Its said it will take our 140,000 troops 12-18 months to withdrawl from Iraq. UNDER PEACEFUL CONDITIONS. Imagine what it's going to be like when 1/3rd of the population is trying to kill you, another 3rd is begging you to take you with them and another third is just cheering from the sidelines. Our military has been bled white because of this nonsense, our standing in the world is non-existent, and our economy's in the toilet...
POTUS 44 will have some serious s#$t to deal with. I wish that person well.
There is no reporting, because every reporter that goes into that meat grinder IS KILLED!
River hasn't posted since October 22.
I hope she is safe. But I worry she isn't.
http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/
The thing about McCain and Bush is they will never be able to solve the war because they do not understand it. They do not understand the players. They don’t get the dynamics of country being invade by foreign powers. What would happen if the U.S. pulled out of Iraq immediately? What would happen next? I think this is what would happen - The Shia tell Iran "Thanks for the help, now leave. Get out of our country." That is the part the neocon war mongers can't seem to understand. Everybody says that Iran will take over Iraq. Or they will have so much influence that Iraq will essentially become part of Iran. Well that will NOT happen. Iraq is Iraq. They don't want to be told what to do by Iran. Just like they don’t want to be told what to do by the U.S. Remember when Saddam invaded Kuwait, Saudi Arabia let the U.S. stage in their country to throw Saddam out of Kuwait. And Egypt helped the coalition in that war. Both those countries are Sunni. Saddam was Sunni. In fact Egypt harbored an exiled Saddam many years ago but Egypt helped throw Saddam out of Kuwait. Being from the same sect did not help Saddam. Saddam didn't listen to Saudi Arabia when it came to Kuwait and Saudi Arabia is Sunni like Saddam. Saudi Arabia let the coalition stage in Saudi Arabia to attack Saddam, a Sunni. Why would Iraq listen to any other country, i.e. Iran or Syria or anybody else? Why would they let Iran tell them what to do? So you see that just because part of Iraq and Iran are the same sect you cannot assume that Iraqi Shia will let Iranian Shia tell them what to do. The Iraqis are only letting Iran help them because Iraq wants the U.S. out! As far as the Kurds go they have it figured out. They're having BBQ on Saturday nights (probably). And the Sunni? They will have to figure out how to have their own area. Joe Bidden knows how this will work out. Most of them have left the country anyway. It will work out without us. And Al Qaeda? you may ask. Well the Iraqis will kick their sorry butts out (no matter what McCain thinks) in a matter of hours after the U.S. leaves. The Iraqis hate Al Qaeda as much as they hate the U.S. for invading. You can bet your bottom $ that no Iraqi will be told what to do by some Al Qaeda nut who all of Iraq hate. McCain does not even know who Al Qaeda is. Obviously the same is true with Bush. All you will see of Al Qaeda is the dust they kick up as they run for Afghanistan. Iraq will kick Al Qaeda out just like they will do to the Iranians, "Thanks for the help. Now get the hell out." The neocon war profiteers don't get it or they want this war to continue for financial reasons. You know this. I know this. 82% of the U.S. knows this. Getting out is the dilemma. The Republicans think that staying in is the delima. I'm sure the military can figure out how the hell to leave. They don't have to worry about all the junk they brought with them. Most of it is trash at this time anyway. It's worn out. Used up. Just get on a plane and leave. Remember Iraq was better off with Saddam. I've said it many times. Nobody wanted to say it at the time but it is true. Let's pack it up and leave tomorrow. You are either with me or... um... ah... won't get fooled again.
"...part of a defense in depth strategy..."
Hmm. Looks like someone might have been paying attention when Hezbollah bloodied the IDF in Lebanon.
Bush's Insane Idea of "Success": Iraqi police in Basra shed their uniforms, kept their rifles and switched sides
Weaseldog @ 54:
ABC News did a story the other night (wish I had captured it) noting that 20% of the oil they are producing is being stolen. The piracy is rampant, both along the pipeline by black-marketeers, and by the truckers shipping the oil to refineries. They'll drain as much a quarter of the load and then "refill the tanker up with whatever they can find... even water... so that the level doesn't change."
Weaseldog @ 57:
I'm hoping she and her family are still in Syria and safe and sound.
Don't fret people, Bush just needs another six months! And the lap dogs in congress will give it to him. They fear they will be portrayed as being weak. The fact is they are enablers. Spineless shills.
seele @ 56:
Only if they report what is actually happening.
Mugsy @ 61:
Yesterday, in Basra, if I'm not mistaken, they blew up a section of the oil pipeline. Someone over there knows why booschCo is in Iraq.
updated 21 minutes ago
Baghdad on lockdown as rockets, bombs fly
Baghdad is on virtual lockdown today as a tough new curfew ordered people off the streets of the Iraqi capital and five other cities until 5 p.m. Sunday. Despite the curfew, rockets or mortar rounds hit an Iraqi vice president's office in the Green Zone, killing two guards.
Unless adherence to the law is restored in OUR country, this Administration will continue to act arbitrarily.
They have their agenda, and that is all that they are interested in. Their enablers in the media and the 25%ers in the country will run interference for them, the compliant and ultimately complicent Democrats in the Congress will allow them to get away with it, and nothing will change.
We need REAL change. We need to return to the basic principles which have allowed democracy in this country, a democracy unlike any other in the world, and never before seen in history, to work.
I'm a very big fan of Gorilla guides and have been reading it a lot to finally get the other side of the story in Iraq in English, which even in the very critical and reasonably objective European media is still lacking because as "white Christians" (sic, this is the way they are seen by possible Muslim death-squads be it Al-Qaeda or anything else) it is impossible for them to get on the field without getting murdered. Although we do see many reports on European media from refugees in Syria and Iran, which I'm sure most white dumb fat gun-and-Humvee loving Americans have never heard of. But still to hear it directly from people still there: Gorilla is currently my only option.
I don't think their words are in anyway harsh, I mean cmon your country has been totally destroyed for the greed of some white petrol-moguls and thanks to the idiocy, racism and bigotry of a bunch of retarded sheep, who thought they were doing the 'good thing': Millions of refugees, children forced to prostitution, arbitrary detention, torture, fearing for your life when doing basic activities like going to school, shopping, no electricity, now water, no job, a concrete wall in your street just so you can put your garbage out without being blasted...
And then of course to be confronted every time with the official narrative of your oppressor: that it's all in your best interest and that everything is going better, when the only thing that's going better is Dick's paycheck from Halliburton and co.
I mean what words could be used to describe such arrogance, idiocy, hypocrisy and cruelty?
Look at how they treat American white women in Iraq, and then think how they would treat Muslim women in Iraq which for many of the lowly educated soldiers (especially the thugs mercenaries roaming Iraq like Blackwater, more than the poor soldiers forced in the army because of lack of opportunities in the US) there are nothing than mere animals, the one breeding the so called 9/11 hijackers (which is the way they were portrayed in US media for a long time, as a way to sell that oil-profiteering-war).
Thumbs up for Gorilla Guide, and reconciliation or any forgiveness for America will only be possible when they'll be ready to face the consequences of their acts, and the words of your victims is just one part of it.
Captain Kangaroo at 58, I think you pretty much nailed it.
pissed off patricia @ 52:
Why use death squads when we can just drop a few thousand pound bombs on them and call it collateral damaged? Those airforce soldiers arn't death squads, those are officers.
Its part of the new way of legitimizing mass murder.
I'm gonna wear out the keys on my keyboard repeating this ..
I strongly believe this is precisely what the NeoCons have intended all along.
It's genocide.
They call it "creative destruction" - completely destroy the physical *and* social infrastructure, slaughter as many as possible, subjugate the few remaining, then let the corporations move in and take over the rubble.
They did it to the American South during the American Civil War, to the American Natives in the latter half of the 19th century, to the Phillipines, to Europe in World Wars One and Two, to VietNam, etc, etc, etc.
It's the way they operate.
It's business as usual for the Colonisers.
Why does everyone continue to pretend that Bush & Company EVER wanted peace or stability anywhere in the Middle East?
People .. this is a no-brainer .. we've been lied to and lied to and lied to .. and told this is a great success .. could take 100 years but we're not leaving ..
WHAT THE F*&^ TO YOU THINK THEY MEAN???
They MEAN what they SAY.
Michael Ledeen (Wikipedia) is one of the NeoCons principal "thinkers" .. read this Wikipedia entry.
Relevant quote:
serrano @ 4:
The democrats are just as guilty as Bush. That is the reason there has been no impeachments.
pissed off patricia @ 52:
The Americans don't just frighten Iraqis, they kill them. When the Americans start a killing spree, they kill everyone they encounter because they are told not to believe that someone may not be their enemy. Get some of the accounts from the WinterSoldier conferences. It will add much to the perspective and the discussion.
*Scenario I: Prime Minister Nouri Kamal al-Malaki using his Iraqi Army engages the rogue elements of Cleric Moqtad