Countdown: Rep. Harman Gives More Details On Bogus Terror Threat On Capitol
By Logan Murphy Tuesday Sep 25, 2007 10:50am
Following up on Monday night's Nexus of Terror & Politics report, Keith Olbermann talks with Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) to get more details on the revelation that the Bush Administration used bogus intelligence in order to frighten lawmakers into voting for last August's expanded FISA bill. Harman says that after much digging she found the classified intelligence document in question and the document clearly stated that the intelligence community did not deem the source to be reliable.
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Olbermann: "Nobody doubts the existence of terrorism or terrorists or the need to act on their existence, but at this point, is our freedom beginning to be or even now already at greater risk from terrorism, or from people who are exploiting the fact of terrorism to gain unprecedented and perhaps irreversible rights to spy and detain and rendition and everything else?"
Harman: "Well, I think this is a-a quite a scary period in our history and there are right answers. We can get surveillance right. I think most of us, maybe all of us in the House and in the Senate support surveilling people who are trying to harm us, but we can do that within the careful framework of FISA. FISA is not broken. What's broken is the view of executive power that some hold in the administration. They claim it trumps all laws and our constitution."
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Just who are the real terrorist's anyway?
So what are the Democrats going to do about it? I'm a little tired of their railing and complaining about something and then doing nothing.
Teflon George strikes again.
and is this not the casebook definition of terrorism?
IMPEACH IMPEACH IMPEACH!
This story should be getting much bigger coverage.
This is starting to sound weird.
The page that stated "the source is not deemed to be reliable". Was that in the report? Where did she get her info?
Did the members of congress actually rely on the media's interpretation of the press release to base their decision to change fisa? Or was it Mitch McConnell who disseminated the info without the caveat, "this is from an unreliable source".
Didn't members of congress see the reports that most of the administrations terror threat claims were exaggerated or non-existent?
There's a part of "we didn't know we had bad information" that is starting to not work as an excuse.
Thank you, Rep. Harman, for being curious and skeptical enough to do the research, and thank you again for being brave enough to speak out. To other members of Congress...where are you on this? Why aren't you joining Representative Harman in making sure that this information gets out?
Frankly, I don't believe that representatives couldn't figure out that this was another Big Lie.
Even I knew it was lie...and last time I looked, I'm not an elected representative.
It's a handy excuse, IMHO. "He lied"...and they knew they could use it for political gain later on.
My take, right or wrong.
It's time democrats start taking responsibility for their actions or inactions as the case may be instead of making excuses every time the republicans cry wolf. They are in charge of Congress now and should be getting first hand any sensitive information about surveillance or security issues. Not the republicans. This republican-democrat, goodcop,bad cop game has got to end.
"They claim it trumps all laws and our constitution.”
ANY law they pass that contradicts the Constitution that was sworn to
uphold and protect is NULL AND VOID.....PERIOD.
MN USA @ 2:
Welcome to the Headbanger's Ball. Where the fuck is Pelosi? Why no ACTION? Why do I ask that question?
Maybe Mr. Brown will fly in from London and save us from this brutal regime and impose sanctions from countries all over the world!
I think the rest of them are afraid of looking like pants wetters if they tell what happened. Afraid of looking like pants wetters because it looks like that's exactly what they are.
Rusty Shackleford @ 6:
Not only should this story be getting more coverage, but Tie this story to the fact that the U.S. is using mercenaries (more of them than u.S. troops) and take the next step.::::
The mercenaries are a for-profit outfit making billions on the fact that we are at war. They have been accused of smuggling in weapons to keep the war going. Blackwater is a company started and owned by a huge right-wing Fundamental group.
How much of a step would it be (in the light of their use of terror on Americans and even the congress) to use these same mercs here at home in the U.S.? Not much eh.
Everyone who serves know the question they ask our military "if ordered to do so, would you take up arms against Americans"
This is much much bigger than folks think. This should be brought to the front of the news and kept there.
Curtilingus @ 7:
I am inclined to concur....her statements as to info being obtained "from an unreliable source"
need further clarification.
We had wall-to-wall coverage in todays Dallas Morning Nudes on the MoveOn ad for the third week in a row.
Doggiebobo @ 15:
Won't get it...for reasons of "national security."
Are our congressmen that gullible to succumb to these fear tactics?
Given the timing of all this, the increased security on Capitol Hill, and six years of the same type of bullshit, you'd think these intelligent lawmakers would see right through it.
crazylove @ 12:
On butterfly wings?
Notice also she has no idea where the rumor started?
the rumor started with the Bush administrations announcement of a threat.
Congressional members are willing to base their decisions on rumors that they do not make the basic inquiry "Who said that?"
That's good that Jane Harmon didn't vote for it. But this reveals a lot about how information is spread around capital hill.
It's only news if the Dems admit they were frightened into changing their votes. They won't, so what we're left with is another example of shady GOP tactics that or may not have influenced legislation.
And who in Congress is following Rep. Harman? Is she alone on this?
but at this point, is our freedom beginning to be or even now already at greater risk from terrorism, or from people who are exploiting the fact of terrorism to gain unprecedented and perhaps irreversible rights to spy and detain and rendition and everything else?”
Leading question much, there, Keith? He's been beating this same drum for well over a year now, and he asks her what, if it's just now beginning?
If he's such hero, why doesn't he jump in her face and tell her he's been making the case for a while that a lot of these terrorist threats were bogus, and where have the Dems been on this?
To me, the most disturbing thing in the story is not the administration massaging of bad intel- that's a given. I'm bothered by Harman and her ilk believing that shitting their pants and trading away constitutional rights would have been appropriate if the intel WERE true.
This is yet more proof that indeed reich-wingers are terrorists.
I'm beginning to think our elected officials are either wimps or just plain stupid.
dman @ 24:
Exactly.
bushater @ 14:
MN USA @ 2:
KO talked about this the other day. Now he's got Harman on talking about it. And?????? Don't Harman & Pelosi know each other? What good does it do to just keep talking about all the crimes BushCo is getting away with? Do something, damn it! Stop letting the neocon nutjobs frame everything. Stop letting cable news talking heads give more time to the nutjobs to spread their lies.
Given the fact that a lot of these same lawmakers insist they've been misled by the admin in the past, you'd think a little skepticism would have been called for.
Frankly, I'd feel better about it if they claimed they were cowed by an episode of '24'.
Probably the most disturbing part for me is she didn't know where the rumor started. If it did not come from Mike McConnell, they picked it up from the evening news. We know that the mainstream media considers the whitehouse a very good source.
So we have our congressional members making decisions based on the information as CNNBBBCBSFOXABC reports it. Notice they also publish the polling information. So our representatives watch the news and feel that they have their finger on their electorate's pulse because they know what the polls say. When the whole time it is a reflection of what the whitehouse wants to think.
Except for the vote, the electorate is completely removed from influencing their representatives.
Oh that's right, we don't have the vote anymore either.
It's becoming clearer every day that the WH push to get OUR Fisa act replaced by THEIR Fisa bill was staged by ordering the placement of armed security/military people around Capitol Hill, to freak out our legislators resulting in their making an emotional decision instead of a rational one, and by conveniently omitting the essential description of the intelligence re "chatter" and the possibility of an August attack as being bogus and/or completely unsubstantiated. Karl Rove is not retired, folks. As a matter of fact, he has more time on his hands now, and is still planning and executing the manipulation of America's minds.
Is Harman revving up for a shot at Feinstein's senate seat?
pissed off patricia @ 26:
POP: I must again give you a quote from Mark Twain:
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But
I repeat myself."......
Seems to be a quite appropriate quote...
WHY do these pols fall hook, line and sinker for every propagandistic trick foisted upon them (and us) and then, months after the fact "wake up" and realize that it's all Bushit?!!!!
Are they really THAT f*cking stupid???????
dman @ 24:
Amen, dman!
One of the other arguments for eviscerating FISA was that it was too inconvenient to do the paperwork, but Bush's secret wiretap order would make it seem that they never tried and/or were never required to do it anyway.
And note the irony of Bush scolding Zimbabwe for its repressive regime when Mugabe openly copied the United States' secret surveillance program.
Why is anyone surprised at this. They signed off on the Patriot Act without even reading it.
This one stunt alone should be enough to impeach. This is a blatantly fascist power grab, and a betrayal of our Constitutional ideals, and it's only the most recent item added to a mountain of similar betrayals. Is there ANYTHING that will get this Congress to remove this treasonous crew of idiots?
I just posted this at another liberal website. Just thought I'd share.
Those of you who listened to the show yesterday, Bruce Fein talked about how people in Congress sometimes engage in petty personal squables and lose focus on the more important issues. He reminded us how Jane Harman was pushed out of the chairwomanship of the House Intelligence Committee by Pelosi in January. I was no fan of Harman in the past, but she is looking more and more progressive than Pelosi these days.
Harman was on K Olbermann last night being interviewing about the statement she recently made on how the Bush administration used a scare tactic to get the FISA bill passed right before the summer vacation. She said they were told of a specific intelligence that was received which indicated that there would be a risk of attack in the summer if the law was not passed. She said there was no official word from the intelligence agencies or the White House, but she said people in Congress were going around spreading this rumor about the specific intelligence they saw. But apparently, the report was marked unreliable. But what did we get from our leaders Reid and Pelosi? The cowardly Reid passed the bill and skipped town putrting the issue on Pelosi's lap. And what does Pelosi do? She came out talking like a tiger at first, and folded like a cheap suit. These 2 so called leaders should have stayed in town, and demanded answers before giving away the farm to these criminals! I am so tired of hearing excuses for these 2. I am sick of it!
Why aren't Pelosi and Feid telling us about this now? Why is Harman the only one screaming about it? Is Pelosi taking this personal with Harman? Say it isn't so, Nancy... say it isn't so. Why aren't they starting a Congressional inquiry about it? Why aren't the Dem's united on this issue, this most important issue of scare tactic by Republicans to terorrize innocent people? Is this the leadership we want from our Demcratic leaders? What are they waiting for? This only leads me to ask the question, are they enablers or accomplices? They have to be called out on it, no matter how much some people here try to defend the Democratic leader. Yes, they are spinless and worse, despite what Randi says, they don't know how to play the political game. Well, maybe they know how to play it, but they have no idea how to put themselves in a position to win!
WE NEED NEW DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP IN CONGRESS
Damn right ETIOLIB.
All the democrats should be up there apologizing "We're sorry we signed away your civil liberties because someone told us (we don't remember who) said we were going to get attacked if we didn't."
ETHIOBIB @ 38: Well stated and I agree.
The biggest problem this method of getting bills LIKE THIS passed, which is a euphemism for SHREDDING THE CONSTITUTION, is that the PEOPLE NO LONGER BELIEVE ANYTHING CONGRESS SAYS anymore than they believe the BOY WHO CRIED WOLF who still sits, pissing on the oval office executive chair.
He pisses not out of fear but out of loathing.
Regardless if this threat was real or not, it just shows you how little it takes for the Democrats to trade our Rights for perceived security. I have nothing but contempt for this Congress. They have backed down to this administration on every issue. Don't get me wrong. I hate Bush with a passion and will continue to vote Dem but I wish there was a viable option to the corporate loving, Bible thumping Repubs and this nardless group of wimps on the left.
The Democratic leadership seems to be functioning off the premise of 'but what if it's really true?'
Thus, they'll protest and protest and protest, but when it comes time to vote NO, out comes 'but what if it's really true?' and they fold. They fear being wrong and 'weak on terrorism' - which is nothing more than a sales pitch from the GOP in the first place ... 'weak on terrorism' is right up there with 'not having the stomach for the fight' or 'not having the will to win.'
It's an ingrained habit of hedging their bets that is sandbagging any gains they made in the 2006 elections. It's like being in a high-stakes game of Texas Hold-Em, and being bled to death by ever-increasing blinds while they wait for 'the right cards'.
anonymous @ 8:
Something good has come out of that spat between Harman and Pelosi, methinks.
Yellowbird@41, you said,
".....the BOY WHO CRIED WOLF who still sits, pissing on the oval office executive chair.
He pisses not out of fear but out of loathing."
That is Literature! I will not distract from it with any comparisons...BRAVO!
Keith O,
Nobody doubts the existence of terrorism, but I do not believe that they are anywhere remotely close to being the threat to this nation or it's security as Bushco would have us all obediently believe. Bush's claims about the danger of the terrorist threat are untenable and non-credible. This has never been anything more than a device to scare Americans into accepting totalitarian rule as the cost of "security".
The scandal is not that a sociopathic petty tyrant and the thugs who make up his "administration" lie and manipulate in order to get what they want. We know they are sociopathic criminals; that's what sociopathic criminals do. There's no reason to be surprised.
The real scandal is that members of Congress are so foolish, so stupid, so eagerly gullible or just so plain rotten-to-the-core-corrupt as to be buying into the lies. After 7 years of neocon lies and manipulation, there is no one who can claim not to know what's going on or what the game is that the fascists are playing. Every last member of congress knows full well what's going on.
So, the spotlight also needs to be shined upon congress (and the federal courts). Those who are supporting the destruction of this country through their support of the neocon-orchestrated all-out war upon our Constitution and our national institutions of self-government need to be constantly made to justify themselves to the public. They are not victims of duplicity, they are accomplices who are mouthing empty mea culpas. They need to have their free tickets to ride confiscated. Only a functioning press can do that.
You, appear to be the only person in the US capable of influencing the non-blogging public, because you are the only possessor of an MSM bully pulpit who also has a possession of a working conscience. You're it.....give 'em hell.
naschkatze @ 44:
Ya' mean Pelosi will lead? Go back to bed.
Cornplanter @ 42:
You left out the best part: They traded our rights for THEIR security.
Great.
Another flat out "illegal" and impeachable offense.
the Bush Administration’s use of trumped up terror alerts to manipulate the American..
and now a bogus terror threat that specifically targeted Capitol Hill to manipulate members of Congress just hours before a crucial vote on the FISA bill last August.
The only reasons I can think of why Congress has not STOPPED THESE illegal CRIMINAL acts…
They are being bribed, spied on, afraid for their lives, or afraid for loosing a later top crony CEO position
Not an easy task taking on a government run like the MAFIA.
Some advice to the Democrats… Stop playing the GAME with Bush…
And stand up to all of them.. NOW. - and start standing with the people
The people will stand with anyone who WILL.
Which may explain…
Just why is Ron Paul getting so much support…
Ron Paul is telling the truth and IS standing up BUSH and all of the GOP Candidates
...AND even the Federal Reserve Mob
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgnfxtrAFJQ
We also remember Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) in 2004... “Democrats should ask tough questions of Porter Goss at Senate confirmation hearings next month, but my view is this is the wrong fight," Rep. Jane Harman, D-CA., said on NBC's "Meet the Press."
Remember that guy... Bush Porter Goss' Skull & Bones connection appointment.
Oh yea.. Goss was confirmed and then proceeded to follow orders and kicks out Patriots in the CIA ….to who knows where..... GOSS.. the guy who COVERED UP the 2nd half Sept 11 report.
Were still waiting for it..
Did anybody catch Pelosi's interview with Blitzer? He tore her up pretty good. She deserves it.
She's making the argument the democratic congress has no power as the majority and cannot stop the war.
So why couldn't they stop the war when they were in the minority? I know they have a thin majority, but her argument does not wash. She is not trying to carry out the will of the people.
If a branch of the checks and balances system of government cannot get anything done whether in the minority or majority, why do we have that branch of government?
crazylove @ 47:
No, I just am commending Harman for what she has done. It actually puts Pelosi and followers on the spot.
Joementum @ 48:
Maybe it would be more correct to say..."They traded our rights for THEIR insecurity."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZL8-XQsgiA&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwhatreallyh...
Here's the Pelosi/Blitzer link. It's an important interview and I'm sure C&L will reference it soon (if they already haven't).
Pelosi is an example of some of the weaknesses that Harman inferred.
Curtilingus @ 53:
Nacy P...YOU make me want to up-chuck with "your" interpretation as to why nothing
is being accomplished w/respect to ending the war in Iraq. Do you think we are all fools?
By the way, how does Congress have a reported 11 percent "favorable" rating?
Here's a great recap on how all this shit started. The most lies I've ever heard spoken in 6 minutes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYI7JXGqd0o&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwhatreallyh...
People are elected to Congress without knowing or caring about their primary responsibilities to represent the people and protect the Constitution. The oath to defend the Constitution is a mere formality, like the Pledge of Allegiance. It's something to get out of the way so that the real business of raising money for re-election may begin. They believe they are there to represent and protect their political party and campaign contributors. Republicans are the worst offenders, but Democrats are not immune the seductive calls of money and power. Our form of government was teetering on the edge of a cliff before George W. Bush became president. He just gleefully pushed it over the edge. The pieces have to be picked up and reassembled into a better model. Do we, the people, have the willpower to do it?
One would think they would be more careful when it comes to the rights of the citizens of this country. They KNOW that Bush is a LIAR and they didn't demand more information? These guys use the same game every time and it always works. I think that her statement they were running out of time is the REAL reason it was passed. They didn't want to use any of their break time and anyone who was paying attention knows that Bush threatened to cancel the break until this bill was passed. Now they are looking for excuses because they know that the public is angry with them all.
Hopefully this time it got through to them, heads will roll if they continue to roll over for this administration and give into its demands.
Naschkatze@51,
To clarify, I'm in total agreement with you. Was only commenting on Pelosi's utter lack of leadership. Is she stuffed with polyester?
I seconf all comments denouncing Pelosi's dereliction. She herself should be impeached at this point. I'm sending money to whoever runs against her. She seriously needs to be put out on the street; at this point I wouldn't even consider her competent to manage a McDonald's.
Same old song and dance. I get so tired of hearing it. The WarPigs do this and that, says this and that, but we found this and that to the contrary. How many years have we heard this? The republicrats go through the motions that they overseeing things, but do NOTHING to kick these criminals out of the White House and prosecute their evil asses. I write letters to my Senators and Congressman (whom are Democrats) and I get the same old song and dance saying how the WarPig does this and that and then end it by saying how they are as 'angered' and 'disappointed' with this Administrations performance, the war and the broad powers he has collected just as I am and will continue to support 'oversight'.
B U L L S H I T
Nothing will be done about anything. The Warpigs would have been gone by now if they really had any intentions of changing the status quo.If the truth be known, they LIKE all the power the WarPig accumulated for the Executive Branch and can't wait to get their girl or boy in the Oval Office so they get them some of that. They like the idea that some people have been conditioned to fear tactics.
Paul @ 60:
You nominate Nancy Pelosi for streetwalker?
Nancy Pelosi is trying to practice tea & crumpet politics in an environment more suited for Jack Daniels and Nachoes.
ysbaddaden @ 62:
How about Jack Daniels and tar and feathers by torch light?
Olberman - "Congresswoman Harman, thanks for your time tonight."
Harman - "Um Hum?"
It this kind of response to being thanked considered polite in US America?
The stasi nostalgists need to be stopped
Rasputin @ 63:
Sounds like an interesting strip joint act.
"Another" by the administration fabrication of intel to get the senate to do something.. Lets see, distilled down to its core with out the pretty p.r. spin... Bushco lied to congress about something critical..... A crime? Naaahhh, Impeachable?? Naaah..
Hey, if it doesn't involve sex, children, mens rooms or priests, it's just not a real problem anymore... Lies by this administration that gets people killed and maimed??? No problem.... Lies that ends up destabilizing society? Ditto... Lies that start wars???
Hell, that's freedom medal time..... Lies that coorce congress into doing things without proper review or reflection? Hey, that's just politics these days... This is a sick picture no matter how one looks at it.
Representitive Harmon states it plainly, "FISA is NOT broken. Whats broken is the view of executive power some hold in the administration". A view that claims executive power is above the law of this land and the constitution. Such brass balls I've never seen out of an administration or U.S. president in my lifetime.. Not even when we were on top....economically and philosophically. Those days are long gone now thanks to the mendascity of this administration and its figurehead idiot an chief...
How many times are the democrats in congress, hell even the moderate republicans, endangered species that they are, how many times are these people going to fall for the same tiredassed boogieman scare story before they get tired of having their panties pulled down in front of everyone and being punked out by immoral assholes claiming to be statemen with the nations interests at heart??? How long, how many more times??? It's getting to be a broken record on this sort of admin bullshit.. And so far, they have gotton away with it e.v.e.r.y.t.i.m.e.......
I don't know how anyone else views all this, but between that acknowledgement of what happened this time by Rep Harman and the definition of the word 'terrorism' explained by K.O.... Seems to me the Bush administration at the least, is practicing the same terrorism it claims others in the world engage in.... But again... At the end of the day... Not impeachable.. go figure.............JD
Who will start the war on terrorism here in the usa?
Rep. Harman?? Wow, I thought it was Cloris Leachman! :-)
Jane Harmon is Henny Penny. She sucks big time.
Did she say "she"? Just shoot me!
MN USA @ 2:
\
Exactly. She turns around and votes to condemn Moveon.
She'll soon vote to give the worst president ever the authority to flush more taxpayer money down the middle east blackhole. I'll never vote for a dimocrap again. F**k 'em all.
Oh, and this is the same politico who condemned the Move-On ad. Come on, all the office holders are one in the same, there is no difference in the way they want to organize the laws of this land. Where I come from we call this form of posturing hen voting the other way talking out the side of your neck. I contacted my representatives office in Washington (David Scott) to inform him that I will most likely no vote for him in the next election. All in all I feel I am wasting my time with these bozos and that I should just make as much money as I can possibly make, then relocate to a country more in line with my so-called liberal views.
I'm with you idiotland and by the way one of my favorite movies is Idiocracy, because w/ all these dummies runnig America into the ground that is exactly what we wil have.
ps. awww &hit its Upgrayeedd.
Stop the funding for this illegal war is the only avenue for democrats at this time. It is time for not just well thinking Americans and Congress members who support bringing the troops home to realize that just like everyone is saying that we have some very smart and intelligent troops that were sent to so call defend this country, only to find out it was all a fabricated lie.
Now if the democrats are so worried about what will be said if they cut the funding, then it is now time to test the troops we are trying to defend.
They should know that if our well meaning congress refuses to fund this invasion anymore and that if Bush is the mad man that they all think he is and refuses to bring them home and would leave them without food or armor to fight with.
I would think they would have enough intelligence to pool together in massive numbers, over power the powers that be, at gun point if necessary and get the hell out of there.
We have to think they would be smart and brave enough to stand up and say I am not going to continue this without the necessities needed to do the job and they could not be held accountable for standing up and telling it like it is. They would be within their rights to do so.
The problem with the Dems in Congress is, they are so chicken shit they can't wipe their asses without consulting an opinion poll first. It's like they are afraid to offend.
If you can't impeach the WORST President this nation has every had, you might as well rip that passage out of the Constitution (just like they did with Freedom of Speech and Habeas Corpus).
[...] Congresswoman Jane Harman [D-CA], a senior member of the House Intelligence Committee, tells anyone who will listen that Congress was stampeded into revisions of the FISA Law by a Bogus Terror Threat On Capitol. [...]
coleshack @ 57:
Anything is possible...but at this point I'm not optimistic.
She said "She" when referring to the next President of the US - is she a part of the vast left wing conspiracy?
I'm no longer surprised by the fascists from both parties.
I am however, constantly surprised by the "outrage" shown by all you so-called "progressives" when your so-called "elected" officials once again show their true colors and screw their constituents.
News flash: WE HAVE NO FUNCTIONING GOVERNMENT
You can't expect the Nazis to investigate their own crimes.
Sheesh, wake the F#$% UP ALREADY.
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