Nataline Sarkisyan passes away. Shame on Cigna!
By John Amato Thursday Dec 20, 2007 2:05pm
We posted this story yesterday with an update to the heartbreaking result. While battling CIGNA for a new liver, her family and friends fought and protested until CIGNA finally gave in, but it was too late---the seventeen-year-old Nataline Sarkisyan died.
Download | play 
Download | play
ABC has the video of the story as it unfolded. And the only mention of health care that we get from the GOP presidential candidates is to use the word "socialized" medicine, as if it's something scary. What's scary is what happened to Nataline. I'm sure her family is so very happy we don't have socialized medicine today. Let's see some Iowa residents bring this case up to Huck, Rudy/McC and Williard. They had a liver for her last week. We know the media is incapable of doing some basic reporting.
Check out guaranteedhealthcare...CNS released this statement:
The California Nurses Association/National Nurses Organizing Committee today blasted insurance giant CIGNA for failing to approve a liver transplant one week earlier for listen to 17-year-old Nataline Sarkisyan, who tragically died last night just hours after CIGNA relented and agreed to the procedure following a massive national outcry.
On Dec. 11, four leading physicians, including the surgical director of the Pediatric Liver Transplant Program at UCLA, wrote to CIGNA urging the company to reverse its denial. The physicians said that Nataline “currently meets criteria to be listed as Status 1A” for a transplant. They also challenged CIGNA’s denial which the company said occurred because their benefit plan “does not cover experimental, investigational and unproven services,” to which the doctors replied, “Nataline’s case is in fact none of the above.”...read on
Login or Register to post comments.
Great example of what happens with for profit health care, thanks you regressive assholes!
Someone needs to go to jail for this murder. And it ain't the docs.
if it were up to me, cigna would be charged in the death of poor Nataline.
they would be held responsible for her death. execs would be jailed, and the company put out of business. of course, this is but one shameful and tragic event of the millions that our for-profit health industry is responsible for.
NEVER FORGET: for-profit health insurance companies profit off of reduced service. thus, cigna made money off of Nataline's death.
8 and 9 figure net worth repubs don't have to see victims of their donor class insurance companies when they chant "socialized medicine" at people that want Single-payer health care
the idea is to delay...
and hope the patient dies...
Site Monitor,
Since this updated story effectively kills the previous thread on the subject, which I just commented upon, might I copy my comment and post it here, since it's relevent? I won't make a habit of it.
[Sure. Go ahead-Sitemonitor]
I read every day and rarely ever post, but this is just the most incredibly heartbreaking story of the year. The saddest part and what is being lost is 90% of the time Natalie's story does not make it to the national stage. Adults, teens, and children die everyday because of insurance companies brazen and outright disregard for human life. While all the insurance execs this Christmas enjoy their million dollar homes, and thousand dollar Christmas dinners, Natalie's parents will be mourning her loss and asking God how another person could just let a 17 year old girl die.
Why aren't the SOBs charged with murder?
Put the liver in her body and sort out who pays for it later. There should have been someone at the hospital that pushed that angle. They should have a policy for such life-saving situations knowing full-well that the insurance companies suck.
I wonder how the "for profit" health care advocates are going to spin this? "Let the market decide"? The system is broken, and even if you play by the rules and have health insurance you still can be denied care that will kill you.
Links aren't working. Please fix.
[Thanks. I've emailed the link fixers-Sitemonitor]
if you go to cigna's web page you will notice that cigna bills itself as "a business of caring"
and, suprising no one, no where in their 'news' section is it mentioned that cigna denied Nataline coverage, that led to her death.
and, again, this is why ron paul's recipe for america is downright dangerous, and dennis kucinich is the only presidential candidate calling for an end to for-profit health care.
A young girl dies and some soul less fuck gets a bonus , we have got to change this Health Care for some to Health Care for all.
I can't remember who said this a few weeks ago when talking about health insurance, but the person said, "Health insurance companies are not in business to look after our health. They are in business to make money."
Sadly, that person is right. Just as car insurance people aren't in the business to see that we are safe behind the wheel. They are in the business to make money.
When a health insurance company can decide what sort of treatment their customers get, something is horribly horribly wrong.
Medical treatment should not be a gamble. It shouldn't be a game between the persuasive ability of the doctors and the insurance company to see if whether or not a life is saved.
This breaks my heart, but unfortunately doesn't surprise.
Hopefully Nataline's death will not be in vain. The way this story unfolded as it did (in real time, without any possibility of spinning the issue) may serve to be a tangible piece of evidence towards stifling the industrial health profit complex we now have. ALL of the presidential candidates should be asked on record their take on all of this, and then when elected, reminded of their answers.
God bless Nataline and her family. Fuck CIGNA.
...and somewhere a health insurance executive is planning a million dollar sweet sixteen party for his or her daughter.
The two news persons are liars.
It is NOT what ALL of the presidential candidates are addressing.
And cigna could have easily approved the procedure. I have no doubt cigna has blood on their hands.
Oh, but let’s not forget that Lispin’ Rudy Giuliani is OK today because of the insurance companies! No universal coverage for him - he's against it! Forget about the tragedy of a 17 year old losing her life due to corporate insurance incompetence - at least Rudy’s still around to exploit the deaths of 3,000+ in his vain attempt to hijack (all puns intended) the White House!
They should involuntarily harvest the livers of the entire executive commitee at CIGNA.
I hope her family sues their ass back to the stone-age It's the only thing those fuckheads understand
Several months ago a friend of ours was in a terrible accident. Thankfully she lived but she was going to need a lot of physical therapy. She was in a hospital in Miami and she lives closer to Orlando area. They took her to Miami because of the extent of her injuries. When she could leave the hospital her doctor wanted her moved to a therapy facility closer to her home for convenience. Her insurance company said they would only put her in a facility in Miami. Her doctor got on the phone and threatened to go to the media with the story if they didn't let her go back to Orlando for her therapy. When the insurance company heard that they caved and fast.
Some of these insurance companies know they are getting away with shit and they'll continue to do it as long as they can get away with it.
It would be very interesting to determine the person(s) who, at each stage of the determination that the operation was not justified, made the determination.
Was it a clerk, reading from a standard protocol of Cigna?
Anyone care to bet that it wasn't, at least at some stages of the determination?
Thanks, Site Monitor,
This is Rico Fraud:
Is defendant a business engaged in interstate commerce? Yes
Was their a conspiracy to commit a crime(s)? Yes, as put forward in their business plan and policies and consitant practices based upon same.
Were those crimes based upon a violation of one of the crimes listed in 18 U.S.C. § 1961(1). Yes.
Has the execution of the conspiracy resulted in harm? Yes, in this case, death.
Is there a specific criminal activity(ies)? Yes, fraud, wrongful death, arguably, pre-meditated murder, which, industry-wide occurs is perpetrated at a rate of 18,000 deaths per year; murder for profit.
Is the criminal activity an ongoing pattern of criminality? Yes, pervasively so.
Is the pattern of criminality longterm? Yes, going back 40 years, and thus constitutes an “open-ended” pattern. The activities are continuous and related, in that the victims are the entire population of their paying customers who present severe, and expensive, medical challenges(a class of victims all of the same general description or circumstance).
Is the method of commission of each individual crime identical? Yes, and is so uniform as to serve as an “industry standard” set of practices.
Does the criminal activity involve the use of, or is it advanced through the use of, mail or wires Yes, mailed invoices and payment of premiums; use of airwaves for advertising, mail, telephones and internet for denial of promised services.
Is the criminal activity (fraud) more than simple breach of contract, falled business activity, broken promises, negligence or dereliction? Yes, corporate policies, procedures, employee compensation practicies and subsequent corporate acts resulting from same make it clear that, while knowingly making representions to their intended victims that they will provide servies in return for payment of premiums, by their own documents and continuing pattern of practices - which would lead any reasonable-minded person to conclude that - they intended aforethought, never to provide such services.
Has the crime been committed within the court imposed 4-year statue of limitation? Yes, the death resulting from Cigna’s fraud and criminal conspiracy occured within the last 24 hours.
It’s time that anyone (or their survivors) who has been harmed by such criminal practices jointly seek joint criminal prosecution/civil remedies against insurance company criminals under the RICO ACT in Federal courts.
Greetings from Canada where 40 years socialized medicine had
lead us down the slippery slope to the evils of communism.
I hope her family sues their ass back to the stone-age It’s the only thing those fuckheads understand
They can't - insurance behemoths like this are protected by the federal government for just such acts of incompetence. They'll walk away from this with nary a hair out of place - not even a bruised ego!
Read Grisham's RAINMAKER - one of the best novels ever written about such insurance greed!
Rub R. D'Key @ 8:
Because at the end of the day, in America, the only crime that matters is getting in the way of someone's profit or bottom line.
This has been going on for a long time, the fact that it takes innocent people to die and an overweight film director to make a documentary about it to get people's attention says a lot about the level of inhumanity that this society has reached.
At the end of the day, people may make a stink about it, but nothing will change. Why? Because for the most part there are plenty of selfish assholes in this society that would rather put a white hot iron coal up their rectums, that contemplate the possibility of their hard earned money being used to help someone in need other than their immediate family or friends.
Cigna's and other health care providers are as guilty as the society which allowed a per-profit health care system to exist and be acceptable. Something that nowhere else in the industrialized world would have been even contemplated or tolerated. It speaks volumes about what our priorities are and frankly I am ashamed... $$$ is what matters at the end of the day. What is a few kids and old people have to die here and there... it is the god given right of a corporation to make $$$. We wouldn't want a socialist system, would we? It being godless and all...
The tragic thing is that most Americans associate socialism with something bad, even though they don't even know what socialism is or what it implies. Shame on our leaders for using such demagoguery...
I keep thinking of the scene in "Blow-Up" where the photographer is trying to explain to a room full of stoned people what he's found and finally hisses, "can't you understand? Someone's been killed..."
Canuck @ 24:
You also have a lower standard of sexual morality. May Gawd have mercy on y'all...
Cigma overruled all those doctors on a procedure they originally approved...
knowing that if they held out long enough they could "make an exception"
just in time...for them. This stinking "news reporter" gets to blame "the system"
and the female "reporter" blurs it even more with the "democrates and republican
candidates" knowing all the while that while both are in bed with insurance lobbyists
the Mocrates are the only ones who are not having sex with them...which is to say
they are the only hope we have.
Bush says we are losing doctors because of frivolous lawsuits. I suggest we may be losing some of them because they are sick of working at the command of insurance companies and just getting frustrated as hell.
So insurance companies are starting to chop off the hands that feed them. They might was well declare war on the American people.
I wish that the woman from ABC would show which Republican candidates are advocating anything more than more or the same for health care in the US. In reality, they don't even mention health care. They are oblivious to the health care crisis but outraged by illegal aliens working at low wage jobs.
If the Democratic candidates are smart, they'll use this. I'm not a fan of negative ads, but what better way to expose the selfish scumbags running on the Repug side than to create attack ads that tell this girl's story. On another note, I'm tired of hearing from our "leaders" how we are the most compassionate, good people on earth everytime an earthquake or flood happens in some 3rd-world country and a few plane-loads of rice are sent with U.S. stamped on them. I think Nataline's story add some balance to that bullshit yeah?
The all-mighty dollar can turn people's hearts to stone.
Samson- @ 12:
Caring...about profit. As a publicly held company CIGNA must, by law, maximise profit for its shareholders (BTW This worked-the stock is up from yesterday's close). It's fascism. The corporations have gotten the government to make profit making the law.
BIGBONEDED @ 13:
These soulless fucks also get big bonuses for laying off workers. 10% of the workforce, 1700 people. What can a guy with a family of 4 possibly need $28m for?
One thing about the media for sure, in the discussion of "universal health care", they want to keep the term "single payer" out of the vernacular, in order to facilitate corporate welfare if universal healthcare should happen. Let's all do our parts to inject "single payer" into the discussion.
One way to do this is, during a debate, ask "During the 2002 campaign, Ross Perot said he would study the universal health care in the countries that have it and copy the system that worked the best. Is the fact that 29 out of the 30 countries who have universal health care operate under the single payer system the reason why you aren't taking this approach?".
Of course, that would have to be a debate hosted other than CNN.
I suppose the question is, for those candidates who endorse the corporate welfare version of universal health care (Obama, Clinton) is to ask "Why do you think that sitting down with industry lobbyists is going to produce a cost-effective health care system when the fiduciary duties of a private company is to maximize shareholder returns?"
Compare this story to the Terry Schiavo story.
I WANT
a mathematical formula so that everytime a "health" insurance company posts it's profits we can figure out how many procedures, surgeries, etc./ people were denied so that they could have that profit ...
and then we can post that number to our blogs
further I want another formula so that we can calculate the of those that were denied procedures, surgeries, etc. how many died because of it!
This is a friend of mine's blog - he is awaiting a liver transplant too
http://billybobswildride.blogspot.com/
(Billy Bob is what he named his liver)
Interestingly enough he took care of a friend and was with her when she died of end stage liver disease - before he was diagnosed with it too.
Here's that story
http://robertwalkingeagle.google...epages.com/ home
I don't care what the The Ron Paulogists (Ronnetts or Ron Paulettes) or CONS or neo-CONS think. Countries with single payer SOCIALIZED medicine their people are doing much better.
On 12/02/07 did a blog post on organ donation
"Do something great this holiday season, become an organ donor"
I am also an organ donor - I encourage everyone to be one.
(the current post on my blog about willingly burning an organ is not about transplants)
Canuck @ 24:
Can I come live with you guys, Commrade Canuksi?
Look at the Health Insurance plans of all the dem candidates. There is only one that would have prevented this tragedy, the Single Payer Plan of Dennis Kucinich. The only way to stop this madness of some unaccountable, service denier from getting between a doctor and their patient is Single Payer. When was the last time you heard of a Medicare patient being denied a bypass? To bad Nataline had not lived out most of her life so that her insurance company was the People of America instead of a subsidiary of bushco murder inc.
If you want change support the only candidate who will make change, Dennis Kucinich!
Oh, and have you signed Wexler’s petition yet? Have you asked blogs you visit to make some noise about it? Impeachment is the road to a different future, one not owned by the CIGNA’s of this world.
.
http://www.wexlerwantshearings.com/
I understand these cretins are in this for the money, but really, how do they sleep at night?
I don't see why Americans should be bothered with the term "socialized medicine". After all, they have fully embraced the fascistic-sounding "Department of Homeland Security". I'll take socialism anyday.
Cigna should be tried for murder BUT--what about the doctors and hospital that would not save her life until they were guaranteed their dollars?
casper46 @ 41:
On a bed that costs as much as my car.
Talk about bad publicity! Cigna is like Clarence Thomas--in the business for self-enrichment, not helping people.
Not letting Cigna off the hook for this at all, but I wonder if the policy was obtained through one of Nataline's [parents’] employers? If the employer has purchased the group policy as a benefit for their employees (even if the employees pay for it themselves) the employer can step in and tell the insurance company to F'n pay. Whenever our insurer has jerked us around, my husband just calls his benefits office and says, "Hey, WTF?" and his employer contacts the insurer to whip them in line. I'm only saying, Cigna may not be the only responsible party to this horrible tragedy.
I can't imagine what this family might be feeling. I am so sorry for them. I cannot find the words to express my sadness and anger.
[Edited-Sitemonitor]
BIGBONEDED @ 13:
Hey! That executive needed that new yacht.
I cannot remember not having universal healthcare and I'm over 50. Even though there are problems with wait lists for non critical procedures you would be hard pressed to find any Canadian who would prefer the U.S. system. My family has had procedures that would certainly have been over a million dollars in the states and the care has always been first rate.
When I hear the right wingers down there talk about "socialized" medicine I am incredulous. The richest nation on earth and they don't look after basic human rights. I'm very disappointed to hear Senator Clinton's plan includes the insurance companies. They are nothing but ruthless bloodsuckers. I'm convinced if the American people knew the truth about "socialized" heathcare there would be an uproar like that which has never been seen.
What if we started calling "health" insurance stock holders "MURDERS" and "cold blooded murders"
it's what they are . . . them and the litteral blood money they live off of
Ref 46 above, I meant to say "one of Nataline's parents' employers..." not one of Nataline's employers.
[FIFY-Sitemonitor]
universal, not-for-profit healthcare = christianized medicine
Blame it on that stinking "socialist" Michael Moore who stirred up
all that trouble to begin with. The nurses and the doctors
stood up and this will happen again and again and MIKE will make
a follow-up sequel and OBama and Edwards will finally get
the message and the drooling, pacified, mortgaged-to-the-max public will
look up and try very hard to figure out what all the commotion is about.
liberalista @ 46:
She had Leukemia, I'm sure she wasn't working too much.
How terribly sad for the family. Cigna stockholders, CEO's and other administration officials have blood on their hands. I will not be happy until this group of thugs are on the unemployment line.
[libralista left a word out. "...Nataline's parents’ employers..." It's been fixed-Sitemonitor]
In Sicko, when Michael Moore visits England, he speaks with a doctor who - get this - gets REWARDED based on how many patients he treats! The more people he treats, the healthier the people are, the more his bonus! I was amazed, and then I wanted to cry at being amazed at BASIC HUMAN COMPASSION. When Michael Moore asked the patients how much their treatment cost them, they just laughed. Could you imagine what it's like to find it amusing that a medical operation would cost you money?
I wonder just how far in the Dark Ages the US really is. I suspect it's far worse than we even realise.
That poor kid. RIP
Samson- @ 52:
We should start calling it that. Ooooh that'll draw their ire!
Canuck Looking South @ 48:
With the US healthcare system. There are also problems with wait lists for non-critical procedures. I get angry when I hear the right-wingers talk about this "problem" with socialized medicine. Anyone tried to get in to see a specialist in the US lately? You have to make your appointment at least two months in advance, and that's just to diagnose whatever you might have so at that point you don't even know if time is of the essence. That business about having long waits for elective procedures applies here as well.
Canuck Looking South @ 48:
When you look at how much money the insurance and pharmeceutical industries spent to purchase HRC, you'll instantly understand why she is
going to prositute her intended officeincluding the insurance companies in her plan..I saw this this morning so I didn't watch the clip. Does it show the GMA guy falling over himself in the end saying "this is terrible . . . but it isn't about an evil insurance company. It's about the system. The system is the problem not the insurance company. . . "
I was waiting for the Cigna commercial to follow.
Canuck @ 24:
Couldn't have said it better. Wouldn't want to live anywhere else.
HEY..... where's all the Ron Paul people talking about all that freedom of choice thier saviour will bring them in health care...
liberalista @ 57:
Two months??? you got off easy, we waited 7 months to see a pedatric neurologist for my son's migraines.
defacto waiting lists
Remember back in the 80's and early 90's when everyone was complaining about how the medical system should be run more like a business? This is what everyone wanted and now we have it. I hope you enjoy it. Insurance companies are running medicine now.
However, I have to point out that no one here knows the details of this situation. It may be that this patient would have died with or without that liver. A liver transplant is a huge operation and many people don't survive. She also may not have received a liver for sometime anyway, it takes a while for livers to become available. I have tried to find out details of this case, but the news reports I have come across are lacking.
You know what ?
Where was the generosity of the fucking HOSPITAL while everybody was ringing their hands over this. Instead of letting her die, why didn't they just go ahead and do the operation with the available kidney ?
Cigna is to blame, but it makes me furious that the hospital allowed profit margins to interfere with their Hippocratic oath to save lives.
Jesusturnedwaterboardingintowhine @ 9:
Agreed...
It's funny how the hospital tries to pass off the blame to the insurance company by having its own doctors write in to support the transplant yet they don't have the will to actually do it and bill later. What about the doctors whose duty is to help? "Oh well, no one would pay - sorry"
Jason B @ 54:
We now live in a pseudo-fascist corporate state my friend. Compassion = Communism, Truth = Liberalism, Pursuing peace = Hatred for America. Adolf...are you reading this from the grave? You must be proud. All that bombing, D-day, etc. and in the end, your ideolgy took hold of the very nation who "defeated" you. Sadly, America has turned out to be just another shiity Empire in the pages of history.
Take a look at what Kucinich has to say about decriminalizing medical marajuana.
http://granitestaters.com/candidates/dennis_kucinich.html
We will never have a sane medical policy in this country until we take the profit and the police out of it.
C. Atrox: I don't think Americans have embraced the DHS, rather it has embraced us.
The tagline on the Cigna website is "A Business of Caring."
Pacifus @ 56:
I've been in this conversation. The response from several of the "real Christians" about this is basically: "Paul said being Christian was about faith in Christ, not healing the sick, so stop trying to turn my religion into communism."
Clever ain't they? No. . . not really. . . they don't know their own Bible. They are chumps.
But Bush's privatized medicine is so much better then socialized medicine because you have more options between you and your doctor. Now Nataline Sarkisyan has no health issues at all.
Just disgusting, well maybe (just maybe) this will give traction to the issue and something will happen, but I'm not holding my breath.
gallery @ 63:
Excellent point. Perhaps if one of the doctors had been a 'Dodd', Nataline would live.
Ahh fuck.
What can you say to this? A desperate young girl is dead, corporate money grubbers played god and decided her fate. WTF is wrong with people that this is our system? There is a crime commited here, and I don't give a shit about the fine print. There is a crime commited here, if not by Cigna, then by our current greed driven health care system. Life and death decisions are going to be made here by a profit driven corporation?!? The profit driven corporation is going to have the authority to play the hand of god and decide who lives and who dies?? Not cool. Not cool. Republicans want to talk about being civilized but they want to act on being barbaric. What is civilized about letting a person die when we have the means to prevent it??? Where is the civility and culture of life in that? Because her insurance plan wasn't good enough?!? Give me a fucking break, man. Really. Where are the Terry Sciavo zealots on this one?
The Doctors involved with this young lady are as guilty as CIGNA is!
Read the Hippocratic Oath at Wikipedia, especially the 1st line, in the paragraph dealing with "Modern Versions and Alternatives?
I'm sure Comrade Edwards will be talking about this
It begins...
Please, read the article from yesterday.
"Nataline Sarkisyan, 17, of Northridge is in the intensive care unit at UCLA Medical Center in Westwood, and her mother says she has been in a vegetative state for three weeks. "
Now, I'm all for bashing the CIGNA for this, but if she really was in a vegetative state, aka no chance of coming back, then a transplant would indeed be a waste of resources. Give the liver to someone who will live and recover. It sucks, but that's the better choice.
Now, this is all based on what are still flimsy details at this point. If she wasn't in a true vegetative state (aka, she'll recover), or she was in a coma because of the lack of a liver, a liver that was denied 3 weeks ago before the 'vegitative state', then by all means, CIGNA needs bashing.
My condolences to Nataline's family.
Clytemnestra @ 61:
The only way to get into see a specialist in a hurry is to present at the ER with a full blown disease. Then the ER attending makes a next day or next week appointment.
It's called 'Crisis Management" It's how this country is run from top to bottom, side to side, beginning to end.
As a person who sews, I KNOW a stitch in time saves nine. If things were managed well at their outset, specialists wouldn't have long waiting lists.
Very sad - and further proof about the US health care system that Michael Moore brilliantly savaged in the doco "Sicko"!
And I'm sure the Bill O'Reilly's of the world will say that the greater evil is "socialized" medicine - because ????
Oh yeah - something about it being linked to the communists???
So what is Bush and his mongrel right wingers worried about - communism? terrorism? socialism?
How about a healthcare system that doesn't just protect the multinational health insurance organisations????
Shame America Shame!
ferd_berfle @ 28:
I know, I know. I feel so guilty.
:o)
Chris @ 76:
Hey Chris: "four leading physicians, including the surgical director of the Pediatric Liver Transplant Program at UCLA, wrote to CIGNA urging the company to reverse its denial. The physicians said that Nataline “currently meets criteria to be listed as Status 1A” for a transplant. They also challenged CIGNA’s denial which the company said occurred because their benefit plan “does not cover experimental, investigational and unproven services,” to which the doctors replied, “Nataline’s case is in fact none of the above.”…
Are you such the accomplished doctor that that is not enough for you?
A ROPE AND A TREE
I only hope that this tragedy brings forth something positive.
Its possible to starve a company to death by starving it of revenues.
Cigna needs to be financially starved to death.
A pox on all those so-called pro-life, family values corporate elitists.
I guess their view is...life is sacred and needs to be protected...so long as it isn't too expensive.
GMA Video Stream
I think I'm