Straw, meet the grasping hand of Bush loyalists.

poor poor chris, he so hopes his (heart) mccain will win.

chris is suffering demential just like mccain.

there's no way mccain will win, he will be lucky
if his heart and temper last thru to the election in nov.

we want a change for America, truth not spin.

Chris Matthews is a sexist retard and nobody gives a f*ck what he thinks. [deleted]

The press hates Clinton because the Clintons give the press a hard time. That is their biggest mistake. America will never elect a man with such a lack of experience.

It is an important election not a spokesmodel competition.

funny,, anyone hear Tony Blankly on Left Right and Center this week? Devastating words about McCain.

IT comes about half way through,, seems he is despised by the Repubs, about as much as Leiberman is by the Dems.

http://www.kcrw.com/news/programs/lr/lr080201primary_roundupsuper

The same poll also shows him beating Hillary Clinton and losing to Barack Obama, both by slim margins

This is absolutely true. Hilary will lose to McCain. Obama can beat him. With Hillary, always triangulating, voting for obvious bullshit to shore up some mythical right wing of the Democratic party (viz. the war, flag burning, Patriot act, etc.) she would look at McCain and it would be hard to tell the difference, except she has a nicer hair cut.

Obama can win against McCain. Now that Edwards is out of the race (which deeply saddens me) we have to push Obama. He will look to new ideas. He wil provide a contrast to McCain. Hillary will just bring bubba along and it will be the same neoliberal crap he stuffed down our throats then, all over again, only now the govt is flat broke. Hillary will lose. She will bring every redneck shithead out of the woodwork. Obama - not so much.

Has anyone noticed that the Repugs are openly campaigning for Hillary Clinton? Their mouths are watering for Clinton to win the primary, they know this is their best chance to keep the WH. Can we survive more years of this lunacy? I don't think so. Please people, vote for Obama, let's take our country back and feel good about our government again.

Anecdotal, I know, but most of the independents I know who are for Obama put McCain as their second choice. Anyone got an explanation for that?

If Obama wins you can expect a ton of people to register just to vote for him.

If Hillary wins a shit load of old ladies will vote for her just because they want to see a woman President before they die.

If Ann Coulter is going to vote for Hillary I suppose I might see my way clear to vote for McCain.
Then I'll start snorting Drain-O and shooting uncut HIV samples into my veins.

As long as we get rid of Bush once and for all I'm open to any and all suggestions.

Tweakerbell @ 9:

The same poll also shows him beating Hillary Clinton and losing to Barack Obama, both by slim margins

This is absolutely true. Hilary will lose to McCain. Obama can beat him. With Hillary, always triangulating, voting for obvious bullshit to shore up some mythical right wing of the Democratic party (viz. the war, flag burning, Patriot act, etc.) she would look at McCain and it would be hard to tell the difference, except she has a nicer hair cut.

Obama can win against McCain. Now that Edwards is out of the race (which deeply saddens me) we have to push Obama. He will look to new ideas. He wil provide a contrast to McCain. Hillary will just bring bubba along and it will be the same neoliberal crap he stuffed down our throats then, all over again, only now the govt is flat broke. Hillary will lose. She will bring every redneck shithead out of the woodwork. Obama - not so much.

I have to agree. I work with grade school teachers (sadly, they're not well-informed...except about the "big tax rebate," which they're following closely and have already spent in their minds). Most are Democrats, the rest about evenly split between Independents and Repubs. My *limited and very informal polling* tells me: 1)yes, they'd vote for McCain ("'cause he's a war hero!"), though his age scares them a bit; 2) most don't know who Obama is (again, sadly), but those who do would vote for him; 3) NONE that I've spoken to would vote for Clinton, and many would relish the chance to vote against her.

And just for demographics, I work on a staff of 45, 41 of whom are women.

My conclusion, skewed as it certainly may be: Hillary loses big; Obama beats McCain, but just slightly; the economy trumps the war every time.

Bob in AZ @ 12:

Realistically, I think it's possible that St. John could beat Hillary - so many people fear/loathe or completely distrust her (count me in the last column) that a goodly number could probably be persuaded to vote for the "safe & sane" McCain. Yeah, I know he's a turd, but MSM won't hold him accountable (while they're constantly attacking Hillary). Once again, our national govt. may reflect the media spin more than reality. And that's the way it is . . . .

Sadly, I agree St. John would be formidible and could beat the much demonized Hillary. . St. John may have a suit of armor as far as the MSM is concerned. He'll just trot out 5 years in the Hanoi Hilton should any member of the MSM dare to criticize him. Of course, Kerry had the same hero aura, but he failed to defend it when T Boone Pickens Rovians attacked him.

St. John is terribly vulnerable if anyone dares to point out that he is just another Bushie. A permanent presence in Iraq, permanent trickled on economics, permanent suspension of Amendments 1 and 3-10.

Perhaps Hillary's projected showing is why she's being promoted by coultergeist and the rest of the blond PR team.

On many accounts, he is very much a liberal. Look at his immigration and enviromnental stance.

I was derided on another post for this opinion, but I'm honestly just giving you a Canadian perspective, so, take it with a grain of salt I guess. Hillary is hated. Period. If she were not a Clinton, she wouldn't be in this race at all. McCain? Old school. He is one of what is wrong with Washington when people spout change. Obama? Young. Unpredictable, so, voters not sure if they want to vote for him. The reality is, people spout change every election, but in reality, they don't want change because they fear it. So they will settle for Hillary or McCain because they are known, and represent old school politics. If people truly wanted change, neither Hillary or McCain would even be in this race right now.

15% Dems for McCain? What the hell?

AshWilliams, I can't believe that number either. So I guess some Democrats are masochists.

Cat Atomic @ 18:

The portrayal of John McCain as a liberal, or even as a moderate Republican is fiction. The suggestion that he could win against Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama most certainly is not.

McCain's actual record means nothing. He is *perceived* as a moderate by people who don't really follow politics, i.e. Independents. They'll vote for him in large numbers, you can count on it.

Independents aren't stupid. They're independent for a reason: usually a set of policies they like or dislike, or a particular philosophy they'd like to see or wish they didn't.

That said, yes, many view McCain as a moderate or maverick or whatever--because they're getting the same media-fueled misinformation that everybody else is. The question is: can Democrats offer up anything that will rebut that? A Clinton nomination vs. an Obama nomination pose very different answers to that question.

rend @ 7:

funny,, anyone hear Tony Blankly on Left Right and Center this week? Devastating words about McCain.

IT comes about half way through,, seems he is despised by the Repubs, about as much as Leiberman is by the Dems.

http://www.kcrw.com/news/programs/lr/lr080201primary_roundupsuper

McCain needs to be likewise despised by any "Democratic Party voter" thinking of voting for that slimeball. Liberals and Democrats need to despise Mr. McCain just as much they loathe Joe Lieberman!

Spread the news---and make sure you despise John McCain!

John McCain is a militarist and an anti-Arab racist, just like Joe Lieberman, and many in the media are!

Wow, is this the same Chris Matthews who up until last week had Giulianni in the top 5 power brokers for this election?

I so want a job as a TV political pundit! It doesn't matter how shitty their track record is, they always get to have the last word as if somehow you knew what the fuck they were talking about.

John McCain is like Bob Dole without the charisma. I predict that if he wins the GOP nomination, he'll run the same sort of lackluster campaign as Dole did.

McCain is popular among people who don't pay that much attention.

So, yeah - he could win.

tballou @ 26:

If they were really smart, Obama would agree to serve as Clintons VP for one term, and then she would serve as his VP. That way they avoid the inevitable downturn that seems to come with second term presidents, they both get to have the hardest and the easiest jobs on earth, and they both make history as the first black and female pres and VP.

Along those same lines, I hope they would both adopt the one thing, the ONLY thing that Bush did right, and that was to empower his VP. Not that he picked the right person or that Cheney did anything but evil for eight years, but it does seem a waste of talent to have a do-nothing VP, especially if they are one heartbeat away.

Unfortunately Hillary is in this for herself and no one else. She sees the white house as the "diamond ring" that Bill owes her for sticking with him during his presidency. She is not willing to compromise, in fact if she gave two shits about this damn country she would have realized long ago what a divisive figure she is, and she would have sit this one election out. She could have done her damn job as a senator, and realize that this election is too damn important to dick around with it. Alas, there is no snowball chance in hell that she will even consider compromising a single inch for Obama, or any other candidate. This is about her, this is her time to shine. Fuck the rest.

We are truly fucked, when we have basically 2 political families thinking that the white house is somehow entitled to them. From Jr. view that since his daddy was there, he somehow has some kind of monarchic gift to dictate what the rest of the country should follow, and this lady now thinking how she truly deserves to one up her husband.

God have mercy on our poor souls...

I heard Santorum is campaigning for Romney. Good old Ricky is leaving voice messages (robo calls) telling voters how bad McCain's temper is. Oh Ricky! I was wondering when you would slink out of the sewers again.

I forgot to add, that in the GOP side, McCain also feels he is entitled to the Whitehouse after compromising with Bush and his slime machine in 2000.

Didn't McCain run as a Whig in his first election?

If Hillary is the nominee, McCain will take the independents, and the republican base will turn out is amazing force to vote against Hillary.

I can't believe this anyone disputes this. The American public is the same group that RE-elected Bush in 04, they will pick McCain over Hillary in a heartbeat.

dharmabum @ 39:

John McCain is like Bob Dole without the charisma. I predict that if he wins the GOP nomination, he'll run the same sort of lackluster campaign as Dole did.

Continuing loops of old blood and guts McCain singing "Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran." should work.

realclear @ 46:

McCain is already starting to spread the bullshit meme that Democrats want to "surrender" in Iraq, an illegal war. His loyalty to Lieberman is also very disturbing, a vote for him is a vote for the second great depression via Iran. May whoever votes for him on super tuesday remember the loved ones they'll have to sacrifice to fight a rich man's war.

McCain and Lieberman are jokes....the two are scared-shotless to go outside the Green Zone to this day, and even with that, need all kinds of military protection....yeah, things are going so great in Iraq that the Bushies and people like McCain and Lieberman have to pay off the Sunnis to have any "peace" there when the military is not dropping bombs that wipe out entire towns and villages. If you call ethnic cleansing and random killing with bombs from above as the "surge is working" and creating more refugees, then I guess its a "success." That scenario will run its course and things will get back to chaotic status.

I call it a loss for America in Iraq indeed. The goals of a democratic Iraq and a better life for Iraqis with free market capitalism has largely failed and for most Iraqis even 2-3 hours of electricity working is a luxury. For most Iraqis, as bad as Saddam Hussein was for being a tyrant, there had been law and order and basic services working there. For the most part, Iraqi life and things such as social services and basic things like water and electricity functions are worse now than had been during the sanctions regime of the 1990s. The promises made to the Iraqi people by the United States and the Bush administration and their sycophants like John McCain and Joe Lieberman have all but failed.

In sum, by all objective accounts which does not mean the United States politicial establishment or its lapdogs in the American media/press, yes, the American goals in Iraq have all failed miserably and have done so long ago. In short, America had lost Iraq by 2004 and counting.

I think any dem will beat any repub this time around. But then I couldn't see how bush could possibly win in 04!

Absolutely McCain has a shot at beating Hillary, despite his bellicosity. He garners higher points with independents and undecideds than Hillary. He is no where as polarizing as Hillary. And quite frankly the country is, and should be sick of the Clintons and the Bushes. Significant numbers of both Democrats and Republicans just don't like Hillary, for whatever reason. It makes no difference whether it's rational dislike or not, it's a fact. Even higher numbers of independents and Republicans will absolutely refuse to vote for her merely on the fact they don't like her, don't trust her, or don't like or trust Bill. This animosity plummets when these same people are asked about Obama.

Hillary vs. McCain means McCain wins by a margin.
Obama vs. McCain means Obama wins by a landslide.

Democrats can and very well may screw this up by assuming Hillary is the safer bet. The problem is, per usual, Democrats do not think strategically. They think just because they like someone, that anyone should like them for the same reasons, and just think the "other side" is crazy and dismiss them as irrelevant. They're voters too! Get over it! Time to leave the Clintons behind. It's old.

John McCain and “The Straight-Talk Express”

A Keating Primer

Anyone vaguely familiar with the political career of John McCain knows about the “Keating Five” scandal. For those not clear on the specifics, we’ll do a quick review:

· In the midst of the savings and loan implosion of the 80s, federal auditors begin investigating the practices of S&L magnate Charles Keating.
· McCain, along with four other Senators, meets with Keating to discuss ways to derail the investigation.
· McCain and his colleagues meet with Ed Gray, the chairman of the regulatory board, and persuade him to delay seizing the S&L.
· Two years later, regulators finally have to seize the S&L for a federal bailout, costing taxpayers $2.6 billion. In the meantime, 17,000 investors in Keating’s S&L lose $190 million.

For someone with a stainless “reform” halo, McCain looks pretty dirty here. So, what does the “straight-talker” do? Take responsibility? Apologize?
McCain defended his attendance at the meetings by saying Keating was a constituent and that Keating’s development company, American Continental Corporation, was a major Arizona employer. McCain said he wanted to know only whether Keating was being treated fairly and that he had not tried to influence the regulators…

Oh, well we have no problem, then. After all, McCain’s job is to look out for his constituents, right?
But Keating was more than a constituent to McCain–he was a longtime friend and associate…Keating raised money for McCain’s two congressional campaigns in 1982 and 1984, and for McCain’s 1986 Senate bid. By 1987, McCain campaigns had received $112,000 from Keating, his relatives, and his employees–the most received by any of the Keating Five…

Okay, so that’s pretty fishy. Still, I guess you could say that just because someone gives you money doesn’t make you best buds…
After McCain’s election to the House in 1982, he and his family made at least nine trips at Keating’s expense, three of which were to Keating’s Bahamas retreat. McCain did not disclose the trips (as he was required to under House rules) until the scandal broke in 1989…And in April 1986, one year before the meeting with the regulators, McCain’s wife, Cindy, and her father invested $359,100 in a Keating strip mall.

http://www.stopjohnmccain2008.com/category/keating/

The Keating Five scandal from 1989 implicated five senators in another corruption probe. Democrats Dennis DeConcini of Arizona, Donald Riegle of Michigan, John Glenn of Ohio and Alan Cranston of California, and Republican John McCain of Arizona, were accused of strong-arming federal officials to back off their investigation of Charles Keating, former chairman of the Lincoln Savings and Loan association. In exchange, the senators reportedly received close to $1.3 million in campaign contributions.

The Senate Ethics Committee concluded that Glenn and McCain's involvement in the scheme was minimal and dropped the charges against them. In August 1991, the committee ruled that the other three senators had acted improperly in interfering with the Federal Home Loan Banking Board's investigation.

DeConcini and Riegle did not run for re-election in 1994 and were succeeded by Republican Sens. John Kyl and Spencer Abraham.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/indepth_coverage/law/corruption/history.html

heliograph @ 8:

Yes, McCain is a threat. He's been turned into a celebrity, via the media's mythologizing narrative that he's an honest, straight-talking moderate maverick, even though in fact he's a gruesome, war-mongering, corrupt, spiteful, nasty, twisted right-winger. Yes, he's a threat.

Enough people have already bought the media's "maverick" narrative and it's hard to eradicate that kind of conventional wisdom once it's taken root. Especially when Matthews and John King and all the other media sycophants can be seen yukking it up with him on a daily basis.

I've postulated in several threads that the media will rehabilitate McCain's maverick, independent image, while simultaneously hyping and pushing the divisions between the Clinton and Obama camps.

What better way to do that than to have Chris Matthews get yet another man-crush on McCain, and have Ann Coulter endorse Clinton?

I'm still worried about the way this is all playing out.

With the twin evils of the electoral college system and the main stream noise machine, McCain could well beat either Democrat.
The media elite are always willing to ignore the racist and sexist attacks as long as they come from the Right wing wackos. A clinton vannot even mention the name of Martin Luther King without being labelled as racist. But McCain will be able to deploy surrogates from Tweety to Goldberg to call Obama lazy, shiftless, smelly and terrorist.
Clinton would be painted with the brush of lesbianism, abortion, hormonal excess and robotic coldness without the press complaining.
Either candidate will lose most of the south, if not all, and the electoral votes, not the general election totals, are what we should be looking at.
The only way the Democrats win in November is if the Republican candidate is caught in a bigger scandal than America has yet seen.

No, McCain is toast. The only way he can win is if we start believing this crap and focus on the horserace rather than bringing out voters to vote Democrat. We're looking at in some cases 2-1 margins of the numbers of Democratic votes to Republican voters in primaries. When even Joe Klein knows it's crap, it's super-duper crapola.

I am an Independent who had to re-register to vote for Obama in the primaries.

For any of the 15 million people who marched against the start of the war in Iraq, there is no other choice.

Obama was with us then, and I think is the best chance now for ending the war.

Hillarys tears in NH were simply about her realisation that she had not been ordained as the next Democratic leader.
Its all about Hillary, and I am sick of her stance that change can only come from inside the government.
Bush shows us only bad change can come from inside the walls of power.

Obama thinks change comes from the people. Good change can only come from the people, imho.

http://dipdive.com/

Heal this nation, repair this world. right on Obama.

I think that mccain vrs hilary would be a vicious face ripping brawl. Both would get nasty and it would not be fun to watch. hilary depends on passive aggressive political tricks and plays every little game she can. The far right will swallow their hatred of mccain and blast hilary day and night. She will fight back in every way she can and her chances of winning are about even.

I think obama has the ablity to stay above the fray, remain dignified and beat the hell out of Mccain. Obama has terrific charisma and could garner a lot of the mainstream independants and republicans in a way that hilary cannot. The far right may spend more energy trashing mccain than demonizing obama.

Whoever spent 5 years in prison (whatever prison) has a twisted psyche for life. Any psychiatrist will tell you, that a person like that should not be the leader of the US. The problem is, the media will never invite a psychiatrists to tell them how freakin' clueless these people are and what a dangerous prospect they keep promoting. They see how sick this is and they should speak out. Come on guys, people like that have the dreams of Nam no matter how many pills they get. The nuclear suitcase should be as far away from the bad as possible -- at least there should be a provision in the manual for guys like that (meaning aged and former prisoners): "the codes may not be given to execute the order unless the mental test is taken and righteousness of the response is granted."

To the Obamistas on this list--you know, when you go on about how McCain would take independents against Clinton, and how Obama supporters wouldn't vote for Clinton, you further a right-wing meme. I was for Edwards. Now I'm agnostic--either is good enough. I'll probably vote for Obama. On some issues one is better than others. You know the score. So I'm getting sick of those so in love with the transcendence of Obama that they are willing to further the meme that if not Obama then McCain will or maybe even should win.

Versus Hillary yes.
Against Obama NO.