Rummy, you did a heck of a job!

It’s too long for here, but I posted a piece over at The Young Turks about Bush’s comment, “but that should not reflect, you know, America. This was the actions of some soldiers“ about Abu Ghraib

Contains cussing...

i find this very important to know that the military officials were against this.........they understand the reprecussions from this type of treatment....

Samson- @ 4:

and don't forget david addington.

the fuck, addington, has been complicit in most of our war crimes.

And don't forget to fuck Yoo!

This absolute War Criminal is directly responsible for captured US soldiers who were mercilessly tortured and then murdered. Boy do I hate this evil, arrogant, stubborn old fool.

That committee hearing was worthwhile watching, get to CSpan-3 and check it out. The arguments fell right down party lines, and the repugs were clammering to look like such patriots. Joe and Graham were trying so hard to dig up 9-11 so much it felt like a Guiliani speech!

So where's the sworn out arrest warrant for the old fart and traitor?

A travesty.

Rumsfeld should be in jail. Along with a few others we all know.

Rumsfeld and company fucked up American's reputation for a generation. Thanks, dickhead! A good reputation is a hard thing to restore. Just ask any girl in high school who got labeled a slut when she really wasn't.

Try, convict, imprison so they can not enjoy the "fruits" of their evil acts. Don't let Bush escape to South America.

Freeze their bank accounts so their families do not get to enjoy spending the ill-gotten-gains either.

They freed up the money that Ken Lay robbed his employees of after he supposedly died. They should NOT be able to have that money while their victims have to suffer as a result of their greed.

Jim @ 6:

Sure, Rummy is a grade-A tool,and he deserves to be executed for war crimes along with Bush, Cheney, Rice, and Rove, but in fairness our enemies have been torturing and beheading people for some time. Not that it makes torture right. It doesn't. But it also doesn't make it right to frame the argument in this way, by tugging at the heart strings.

War has never been pretty, and it is a disservice to those who would attempt to make sense of this mess we're in that the best you can do is: "God forbid they get captured." Well, duh. Better hope we don't get nuked, either.

Exactly who are these 'enemies' who have tortured and beheaded captured American soldiers ?????

Talk about framing an argument.

Can't believe this guy isn't in prison yet.

Dr. Acula @ 12:

Will he be getting a sternly-worded letter from Conyers?

Speaking of Blow hards, what ever happened with Conyers kicking Rove's ass? What a useless piece of shit Conyers is, and the god folks of Detroit will re-elect this sorry excuse of a human being next time around. every time this idiot opens his pie hole I laugh my ass off!

Jim @ 6:

Sure, Rummy is a grade-A tool,and he deserves to be executed for war crimes along with Bush, Cheney, Rice, and Rove, but in fairness our enemies have been torturing and beheading people for some time. Not that it makes torture right. It doesn't. But it also doesn't make it right to frame the argument in this way, by tugging at the heart strings.

War has never been pretty, and it is a disservice to those who would attempt to make sense of this mess we're in that the best you can do is: "God forbid they get captured." Well, duh. Better hope we don't get nuked, either.

Which war are you talking about, and which enemies?

To the best of my knowledge, we are not at war. The occupation in Iraq has produced a shitload of enemies, which feeds the war profiteers, including Big Oil.

This is a manufactured scenario, and the torturing of people simply satisfies the sadism of the neo-cons.

I think it's about time we stop referring to this national/worldwide nightmare as a "war".

I have wondered what the effects are upon the soldiers who are ordered to torture are. How do they feel when they get back? What do we have left when a person has either been forced to brutalize others or who learn to enjoy it (we all rationalize our actions in some way)? We all try to find pride in a job well-done. Yes, I do condemn those who accept the task, even if it's for "God and country". Gott und Heimat. There must be some basic morality.

But it is the people who order this to be done from a distance, who think that they have clean hands because they don't get them dirty with the actual work, but who actually brutalize the torturer and tortured.

I have read that there are members of Skull and Bones who were branded with a hot iron by GWB while pledging for the organization and that he giggled and showed great enjoyment while doing it. The interview that GWB gave to Mr. Bowtie where he giggled and mocked a woman who had begged him for her life while on the way to the execution chamber.

These are the people who lead us and who believe that they are the ones who must be the leaders of this country because they are superior to the masses. These are the people who insisted that they have the right to dissolve our government should any undefined calamity occur, who have suspended habeas corpus for those who oppose them and who have had the laws against posse commitatus (use of troops against the populace of this country). This is also an administration that has set up a corporate army of hundreds of thousands of private soldiers (ie: Blackwater) who hold allegiance to right winger leaders.

Let us pray for this country and let us not be prey to these people.

Okay, so I know the lesser of evils this election, the democrats, are just letting this slide because keeping these unpopular scum republicans in office actually helps their chances in November. But please, please someone tell me that if..IF...the dems take the white house and more than a one-seat Senate majority, that just seeing them lose their jobs won't be enough, and someone will insist on these administration criminals be punished under the law!

Wanna see me imitate a pickle again?

I remember reading about these military lawyers years ago...and yet never heard a word about it in the media.

and what is the "top" story on the shit-ass cnn.com?

"Tiger to miss rest of season"

well, thank god that cnn is on top of the important news!

fuck cnn

From the Guardian article:

After the Abu Ghraib prison scandal cast scrutiny on Rumsfeld's December 2002 approval of 15 interrogation methods - including forced nudity and hooding of prisoners - Pentagon advisers claimed that the tactics originated with lower-level officers.

(edit: ie, Rumsfeld allegedly approved "methods" that lower-level officers had requested permission to use.)

According to witness testimony today, Rumsfeld's senior lawyer began inquiring about controversial new tactics three months before a junior military officer first put the 15 methods in writing.

William Haynes, a Rumsfeld protégé who resigned as Pentagon general counsel earlier this year, asked in July 2002 whether Guantánamo Bay interrogators could borrow tactics from a military training programme known as Survival Evasion Resistance Escape (SERE).

SERE training is intended to help US troops resist cruel tactics that may be employed by enemy armies, such as waterboarding, sleep deprivation and forced standing in "stress positions".
..
Haynes, who hired a criminal lawyer after leaving the Bush administration to help him handle the Senate investigation, is expected to testify before Levin's committee later today.

Haynes has testified under oath that the approval of abusive tactics at Guantánamo Bay, which lasted only weeks before being revoked in early 2003, did not originate with his office.
..

Pretty open and shut case of perjury.

It's vacation time. Maybe would like to visit Germany. I'm certain they'd give him a visa so he could see the arrest warrant. How about the Haugue?

I wonder if he can even spell "The Hague?"

don't forget this arrorgant clown who was part of the legal team to give the go ahead. here's a short opinion.....
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/06/17/yoo/index.html

Does he know there is no statue of limitations on war crimes.... Ah the fuckers is about 80 years old and he smokes and drinks like a fish. He must be about ready to Russert.

Jim @ 6:

Sure, Rummy is a grade-A tool,and he deserves to be executed for war crimes along with Bush, Cheney, Rice, and Rove, but in fairness our enemies have been torturing and beheading people for some time. Not that it makes torture right. It doesn't. But it also doesn't make it right to frame the argument in this way, by tugging at the heart strings.

War has never been pretty, and it is a disservice to those who would attempt to make sense of this mess we're in that the best you can do is: "God forbid they get captured." Well, duh. Better hope we don't get nuked, either.

Please elighten me, when was the last time an American military POW was tortured and beheaded?

ysbaddaden @ 34:

16 Left&Left

We may not be constitutionally at war, but what Jim @ 6 is saying is right in saying we can't let war-crime trials distract us.

Part of the reason Germany could rebuild so fast right before invading Europe was because people took their eyes off the ball, mostly due to a worldwide Depression.

In France they were also distracted by a sensational trial, where a man was murdered who was selling stock on the guaranteed credit of the Credit Union of France. There was talk that his killer may've been a well placed official of the government.

One good thing is most of the terrorists we'e dealing with now, don't seem to be connected to any enemy country like a modern Germany, but tend to work as individual cells, not knowing each other's plan, but also not able to cooperate with authorities because of their limited knowledge of each other.

And how would the War Crime trials "distract us" and what does that mean? I am sick of hearing that tiresome phrase "This is the greatest country in the world". Policing ourselves by going after our own War Criminals would be a way in part to prove that claim(Since we seem to love policing the world). Prosecuting vile people like Rummy, Rice, Cheney, Bush, etc. shouldn't be a "distraction", murderers go on trial every day in this Nation...believe me.

i believe the majority of the republican party stood by this.....some members of the house and senate did speak up to deaf ear......everyone understands it's war and there are dangerous people involved....this administration wants to have it's own rules whe the rules have already been established...this country was founded on separation of power principles, involving the judicial&executive branches the latter cannot be the judge of it's own judgement.....the very senior senator byrd said in all his years during his years of service and under several presidents...he never experienced an administration like this one..who completely ignored the legislative branch....not unlike a dictator.

karl @ 51:

i believe the majority of the republican party stood by this.....some members of the house and senate did speak up to deaf ear......everyone understands it's war and there are dangerous people involved....this administration wants to have it's own rules whe the rules have already been established...this country was founded on separation of power principles, involving the judicial&executive branches the latter cannot be the judge of it's own judgement.....the very senior senator byrd said in all his years during his years of service and under several presidents...he never experienced an administration like this one..who completely ignored the legislative branch....not unlike a dictator.

A more important problem is that the Democratic party "opposition" has not only not opposed but by at large enabled this cabal.

I cannot believe what I am reading in the comments. Come on!

If we are so proud to be American, why is that? Because we have basic rights, freedom and liberty as citizens. That we all seem to take for granted. It doesn't mean whohoo, I'm American I'm #1 and can kick your ass to kingdom come.

It means we citizens cannot be thrown in jail without knowing what the charges are. We have the right to a trial. We are considered ######## until proven guilty. etc. All of us have these rights, including the worst serial rapists and killers that live right next door to us. We believe that no government power has the right to throw citizens or others into jail willynilly forever.

We believe in the Constitution and Geneva Conventions because they uphold basic rights and human rights and dignity. Torture is an outrage no matter who is doing it to and no matter the circumstances. It is never justified. That is what it means to be a decent and proud American. To hold these things up as our values.

Get a grip people.

The Dude @ 53:

karl @ 51:

i believe the majority of the republican party stood by this.....some members of the house and senate did speak up to deaf ear......everyone understands it's war and there are dangerous people involved....this administration wants to have it's own rules whe the rules have already been established...this country was founded on separation of power principles, involving the judicial&executive branches the latter cannot be the judge of it's own judgement.....the very senior senator byrd said in all his years during his years of service and under several presidents...he never experienced an administration like this one..who completely ignored the legislative branch....not unlike a dictator.

A more important problem is that the Democratic party "opposition" has not only not opposed but by at large enabled this cabal.

i somewhat agree but what i'm saying they had pre-planned counter moves for every move the opposition had...they wanted to be the judge of their judgements...the dems didn't have the majority..bush had their backs against the wall...they were fighting us also the ones that had questions and al queda....like scott mcCellen has told us they were constantly in propaganda mode to instill fear into the public..every move the opposition took they would question your patriotism/troop support.....i personally saw it as so over the top something wasn't right ...and it's surfacing..what gets me is the spin the dems are soft on terror that's what they are doing now so they can continue this with mccain

Dems are soft on domestic terror, ie the GOP.

Do you think Rummy is self-aware enough to look back at all the smarmy remarks he made to reporters during press conferences and feel like a complete tool? Yeah, me neither.

Rather than hanging, we should force him to watch himself lying and belittling people over and over for the rest of his life.

What a jerk.

Keeping our eyes on the ball means to protect ourselves from all enemies here and abroad.

But then I wouldn't want to date a dangerous broad.

booshco qualifies for the domestic enemy tag because of their abrogation of the constitution and the usurption of the powers and responsibilities of other government branches.

If Nancy Pelosi doesn't get off her ass and put impeachment on the table she is going to face a backlash like she never dreamed of. Letting these murdering criminals walk for political expediency will end her career and put her in the annals of history next to Neville Chamberlain and George W. Bush.

They probably have pictures of her with the donkey! Whatever they have against her it must be good.

Read em and weep:
Someone should write a book about this crew called: "The Dumbest Guys in the Room"

Memorable Quotes by Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld

"I would not say that the future is necessarily less predictable than the past. I think the past was not predictable when it started."

"We do know of certain knowledge that he [Osama Bin Laden] is either in Afghanistan, or in some other country, or dead."

"We know where they are. They're in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south and north somewhat." –on Iraq's weapons of mass destruction

"Death has a tendency to encourage a depressing view of war."

"Freedom's untidy, and free people are free to make mistakes and commit crimes and do bad things." –on looting in Iraq after the U.S. invasion, adding "stuff happens"

"[Osama Bin Laden is] either alive and well or alive and not too well or not alive."

"I am not going to give you a number for it because it's not my business to do intelligent work." -asked to estimate the number of Iraqi insurgents while testifying before Congress

"I believe what I said yesterday.
I don't know what I said, but I know what I think, and, well, I assume it's what I said."

"Needless to say, the President is correct. Whatever it was he said."

"Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know."

"There's another way to phrase that and that is that the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. It is basically saying the same thing in a different way. Simply because you do not have evidence that something does exist does not mean that you have evidence that it doesn't exist." -on Iraq's weapons of mass destruction

"It is unknowable how long that conflict [the war in Iraq] will last. It could last six days, six weeks. I doubt six months." -in Feb. 2003

"Well, um, you know, something's neither good nor bad but thinking makes it so, I suppose, as Shakespeare said."

"Secretary Powell and I agree on every single issue that has ever been before this administration except for those instances where Colin's still learning."

"I don't know what the facts are but somebody's certainly going to sit down with him and find out what he knows that they may not know, and make sure he knows what they know that he may not know."

"I'm not into this detail stuff. I'm more concepty."

"If I know the answer I'll tell you the answer, and if I don't, I'll just respond, cleverly."

"Oh, Lord. I didn't mean to say anything quotable."

We don't hear much from Rummy lately. What's he been up to? For a while, it was common knowledge he still had an office in the Pentagon. Is this still true? Rummy is probably certifiable insane, but he's a crafty mofo.

Underground Pirate @ 68:

Why isn't Rummy under investigation? Congress is useless.
This country is really a piece of shit sometimes!

For the past 7-1/2 years for sure.

these guys are convinced they're right about this......in addition to that they don't care i firmly believe they want this war to go on.....treating prisoners like this will help make that wish come true........they have no intentions of getting out of iraq and/or afghanastan....they want to piss off the arabs...taliban...they know where the oil is and they know china is aware also. these are oil guys crude at all cost.

Kald @ 74:

"Not only does torture utterly ruin our image overseas..."

I have to ask like Jon Stewart a couple of entries below: Are you watching the same news we are? How is it possible for anyone, even in the US to believe for a moment anything the Bush white house says about war related matters?? Especially when all evidence points in an opposite direction! Even people writing on this blo... I mean Online Magazine!! (sowwy)

Come on... just think about it. Everything that is uncovered about this war and how it came about is always a few degrees worse than anyone could imagine. How long do the people running this country get the benefit of the doubt?

6 to 7 months or so.....we have to hang on.....word is if bush gets pushed too much .....could push him over the edge.....attacking iran......and finding a way to extend his time in office

What do you expect from the man that brought us Aspartame and brain tumors.

karl @ 75:

Kald @ 74:

"Not only does torture utterly ruin our image overseas..."

I have to ask like Jon Stewart a couple of entries below: Are you watching the same news we are? How is it possible for anyone, even in the US to believe for a moment anything the Bush white house says about war related matters?? Especially when all evidence points in an opposite direction! Even people writing on this blo... I mean Online Magazine!! (sowwy)

Come on... just think about it.